Post Magazine: Crows: A Murder Mystery

For years, black crows congregated in writer Mary Battiata's yard in Arlington. They were a barely noticeably constant in her life. Then this spring, they failed to appear, and, oddly, she missed them. So she decided to find out more about the creature formally known as Corvus brachyrhyncos.

Battiata -- whose article "Crows: A Murder Mystery" appeared in yesterday's Washington Post Magazine -- was online today to field questions and comments about the article.

The transcript follows.

Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.

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Marietta, Ga.: Your article didn't mention the ability of crows to talk, like parrots. While growing up in Huntsville, Al., a friend of mine who hunted a lot owned a crow he found as a baby. He taught the crow to say "hello, Cecil!;" The crow's name was Cecil. My friend kept him in a cage in the backyard, big enough for Cecil to perch and fly around a bit. Sometimes, Cecil would get out and fly up to the power lines. We'd throw frisbees at him and he attempted to catch the frisbee in his mouth. As your excellent article mentioned, crows are very smart. They also like shiny things, like car keys.

Mary Battiata: Hi and thanks for writing. That's interesting about the mimickry.
Re crows and shiny things: I had heard that too but Kevin McGowan, the Cornell University ornithologist I visit in the piece, says that such behavior is characteristic only of crows raised in captivity, or habituated to humans. Crows in the wild will manipulate and play with any object -- twigs, pebbles, etc., and are not particularly drawn to shiny objects, i.e., keys, wristwatches, etc.

By the way, McGowan has one of the best websites I've seen on crows, and FAQ's about crows. The url is www.birds.cornell.edu/crows/crowinfo.htm

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Herndon, Va.: Ms. B: A great article! In suburbia, what are crows' #1 predator (besides man)? I would assume cats - if a crow is on the ground, but what else?

washingtonpost.com: Crows: A Murder Mystery (Post, August 3)

Mary Battiata: number one crow predator in suburbia is still the owl. I don't think cats are much of a threat, except perhaps to fledglings and nestlings.

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Falls Church, Va.: Twice a day, at dawn and dusk, a large community of crows would navigate over my house on their way from and to their roost. It was remarkable how the entire flock interacted and communicated with one another. They were such a marvel. They are gone.

Mary Battiata: Yes, apparently the roosting you see in autumn is a two-part process. The birds gather in a pre-roost flock, and once together, head for the roost itself, which may be as close as a street away.

Keep in mind that while there are reports of the small summer roosts, large-scale roosts occur only in late autumn, early winter.

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Burke, Va,: I love crows, and like to watch them. They are much more fun for a human to watch then a lot of other birds, as they have conversations, arguments and discussions. They are about survival though, and I've seen them eating a bat and another crow that died of something.

Mary Battiata: that's right. Crows will eat other crows, although it's not common.

Crows are not nature's only omnivores. In my reporting I came across reports of white-tail deer eating songbird nestlings -- the deer evidently stand on hind legs and pull the young birds out of the nests.

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Annandale, Va.: Hi Mary, nice article on the crows. Toward the end you speak of a starling nest in a barberry bush. Starlings nest in cavities, bird houses, etc. You may have been mistaken to either the birds were not starlings or they were not nesting there. Perhaps some young ones were resting there? Glad you've learned to appreciate crows. - James

Mary Battiata: That's interesting.

The nestlings in the barberry bush survived only a few days out of the egg. They had yellow beaks, gray-brown feathers. The eggs were blue-green and speckled with black.

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Columbia, Md.: Thank you for the article on crows. The previous week I was speaking with a colleague about the intelligence of crows. I recently begun watching them in my own backyard. It had also seemed to me that there were fewer crows. Where there were usually 4-5 crows hanging out, there was now only 1, and occasionally 2.

Question: Should we regard the reduction in crow numbers solely as a consequence of the coincidence of intentional poisoning and the West Nile virus, or do you think the problem is possibly something broader (I'm thinking of the disappearance of frogs and the correlation with the Greenhouse Effect)?

Question: Why do you think it was important to write the article about crows? When, in the research process, did you realize that the situation with diminishing numbers of crows was complex and somewhat disturbing?

Mary Battiata: That's a reasonable question, but I didn't hear any suggestion of that from ornithologists I questioned.

Most seemed to think that the crow numbers were down because of West Nile, with poisoning being a factor in the Northern Virginia area.

But Kevin McGowan, at Cornell, has noted that fewer crow eggs hatch in areas of the town of his town, Ithaca NY, where homeowners are using heavy doses of pesticides, herbicides and other lawn care chemicals.

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Pikesville, Md.: Excellent article on the American Crow. There is a resident family (5-7 members) that has nested for years in the tops of Norway Spruces on my property. This year two nestlings have sucessfully fledged. One block down the street, Red-Shouldered Hawks were also sucesseful in raising their 2 chicks - over the strong objections of the crows. West Nile apparently killed one crow 2 years ago, but none last year or this year. I have heard by way of the Audubon Christmas Bird Count that Chickadees are also suffering declines along with Crows - any thoughts as to why these 2 species are so affected? Have Fish Crow numbers also declined?

Mary Battiata: I'm sorry I don't have any information about fish crows. I have noticed what I believe to be fish crows in my neighborhood in the past week.They seem tentative, but appear to be scoping out the territory.

Re chicadees: there is as yet no clear understanding of why some bird species are more vulnerable to West Nile virus than others. Peter Marra at the Smithsonian Institution Environmental Research Station, and others, are doing work on that question right now.

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New York, NY: Can you say anything about the tales of crows 'holding court'? I had it described to me as a group meeting at which they seem to discuss (loudly) the merits of a member of the group...and occasionally some social action is taken at the end. Any basis in fact?

Also, RE mimicry, one of my favorite attractions at the Bronx Zoo when I was a child was George, The Talking Crow, who was able to mimic human speech startlingly well.

Mary Battiata: That's the second report this morning of crows mimicking human speech.

Re crows holding court: at the Cornell U. compost yard in Ithaca, McGowan said he had often seen two crows fighting to the death, presumable over territory, and that when one bird began to clearly look the loser, other crows would fly over to get in their licks. I suppose that could be considered a "court," although obviously the social action taken at the end is extreme. I do not know of any other crow courts, or councils, but it doesn't seem unlikely.

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Maryland: It seems to me the crows have gotten larger in size over the years. Is it that I am seeing the same crows returning year after year who are growing each year and I am seeing fewer younger crows, or has the species as a whole grown larger, or is a different breed of crow making its way into the area in recent years?

Mary Battiata: McGowan has had the same question up in Ithaca. He says there is no evidence that crows are getting larger.

Keep in mind that fish crows look identical to American crows except they are slightly smaller and the fish crow has been moving up from creek and river bank areas into higher woodland terrain in this area in recent year. That could account for what you're seeing.

McGowan's website has more information about this and other questions about crow behavior, biology.

IT's www.birds.cornell.edu/crows/crowinfo.htm

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Alexandria, Va.: I, too, have bemoaned the loss of crows in my neighborhood. I'm still not clear why crows are being poisoned. They certainly played an important role in cleaning up the many not-so-bright squirrels. What's the justification given for these wholesale killings?

Mary Battiata: The USDA Wildlife Services division says their poisoning program was begun several years ago at the request of local property owners, who demonstrated that crows were causing property damage. I presume this means crow droppings.

John Hadidian of the Humane Society of the United States (he's at HSUS office in Gaithersburg) is watching this and has led the Humane Society's protest of the practice.

The Humane Society has been unable to get more than very limited informatino about the scope, dates and locations of the poisoning. But the USDA did confirm to me that they have carried out the poisoning in several locations in Northern Virginia for the past several years.

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Syracuse, N.Y.: Hi Mary,

I recently read an article by someone talking about how crows make wonderful and interesting pets. He said that as a child the practice was to adopt a baby crow and raise it. Have you heard of this kind of practice? Is it legal.

Mary Battiata: I believe that keeping crows as pets is illegal under the Federal Migratory Bird Act. You might check with the Audubon Naturalist's Society in Chevy Chase Md. to confirm that.

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Alexandria, Va.: I loved your article - I live in the beverly hills area where your article noted that the number of nests has diminished from 15 to one...so sad! I have really missed the crows this year, and I am hoping they return. Did you get any indication of how quickly a population might reproduce/return?

Someone in my neighborhood used to leave peanuts for the crows, and they would come and wash off the peanut shells in the birdbath on my patio. Clever! But this year there have been no shells.

Mary Battiata: Yes raw peanuts in their shells are a favorite crow food.

Re how soon the crow population will return to normal levels: there is no way to know, but McGowan and others told me it could be several years.

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College Park, Md.: Interesting article, and well written. I do not share you enthusiasm for crows. I lived in urban Seattle for 3 years and I awoke regularly to the cawing of crows at 4:30 and 5am. I have never flirted closer with the idea of owning a gun in my life. My friend who lived in a other part of Seattle actually bought a BB gun and, after checking with federal regulations, began shooting at crows from his backyard, killing many of them. There are many injustices in this world, but crows drove two grown men to sometimes desperate measures. Why? Imagine songbirds and other native species that are actually wonderful to listen to early in the morning. That is what it used to sound like. But crows and bluejays are so aggressive, dare I say, murderous. And, yes, no doubt, we are to blame. After federal authorities began eradicating crows in Northern Virginia you wrote that "there was scant outcry about the truth -- that crows were being exterminated like vermin." There may have been scant outcry because they are precisely that.

Thanks for my 0.02...

Mary Battiata:
Thanks for your candor. I have a dog who's doing the same thing to me these days, so I understand what lack of sleep can do to a grown person's psyche.

Not to keep mentioning KevinMcGown, but you might find his website's FAQ about crows to be interesting. He's very practical and unsentimental about crows, and the site offers ideas about non-lethal but effective ways to drive off crows whose early morning caw-ing is driving you crazy. They are noisy, and pretending otherwise probably doesn't do them or us much good. If I had a roost outside my bedroom window I'm sure I'd be thinking about how to try and help move it on ...

the site is: www.birds.cornell.edu/crows/crowinfo.htm

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Springfield, Va.: Hi Mary,

I have never seen an owl attack a crow, but it realy must be amazing especially if it's a full grown crow. I have seen crows harass a hawks and find it unusual that the hawks don't fight back.

Mary Battiata: Hawks are to crows as traffic is to humans, is how McGowan put it. If you keep an eye out for it, and avoid it, it probably won't hurt you.

I recently heard a reliable eyewitness account of an owl carrying off a domestic cat. Crows are terrified of owls, and one of the reasons they are thought to have taken to congregating in parking lots at night is that the open vistas, fluorescent lighting and clear sightlines give them ample warning time of owl attack.

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Glenview, Ill.: In the late 60's when I was in the Air Force,
I had a crow as a pet. When I went to the beach I would tape a black "X" on the roof of my Volkswagon Beetle, so he could follw me in traffic. When I went to work, I would take the tape off, else he would be a pest all day.

That same bird landed in some duck weed, thinking it was lawn. As he thrashed to keep from sinking, I ran in and pulled him out. My wife washed him in the kitchen sink and we dried him off with her hair dryer, which looked like an old vaccuum cleaner.

The next morning, we were facinated to see him in the sink taking a bath in a spaghetti pot that was soaking. He then went to the hair dryer and pecked on the button until it turned on. After drying himself off, he remained orange wirh dried spaghetti sauce for 3 days

Mary Battiata: I believe that's the best crow story I've ever heard. I'm going to remember that one.

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Woodbridge Va.: Thank you for your article about crows.I see them in my backyard when I throw out some bread. Two weeks ago I threw out some pizza crust and observed how smart they are - they throw the hard crust in the birdbath to soften it before eating it. But the squirrels can chase them away from the bread.They are remarkable birds. Thanks

Kristina

Mary Battiata: I'm told they love raw peanuts in the shell.

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Burtonsville, Md.: I enjoyed your article Mary and perhaps now I have a little more love in my heart for Crows. I do want to inform you that those Crows in your yard didn't die. They're in my back yard chasing away all the beautiful song birds from my feeder.

Paul

Mary Battiata: Right they do dominate ... wonder if they'd be less dominant at the songbird feeder if you distracted them with peanuts in another part of the yard.

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Washington, D.C.: Thank you for the excellent article. Here in Foggy Bottom, we've certainly seen the decline in the number of crows in the last two years, from more than a dozen to only two (who live on top of a construction crane). I hope McGowan is right about the species eventually recovering.

Mary Battiata: Me, too. McGowan was certainly not happy about the numbers, but he was very certain the species would recover.

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Potomac, Md.: Hi. Interesting article!
How many crow winter roosts are there in the DC area and where are they? I recall one near Rockville Pike and Montrose Rd. Seemed like thousands of birds. How many crows make up a winter roost?

Mary Battiata: You're right. That Montrose Rd. roost is a famous one. There's one near the Barcroft Recreation center in Arlington that I know of. And one near Beauregard St. in Alexandria (though that reportedly is one of the one's that's a USDA poisoning location.)

Crows' winter roost size varies -- there's one near Ithaca of 3000 and one in Oklahoma said to number in the hundreds of thousands, and perhaps more. (Hard to count them. Carolee Caffrey, the ornithologist I mention in my story, now with the National Audubon Society outside Philadelphia, witnessed a huge roost near Stillwater OK. She used a team of assistants and each was told to stare at one small section of the roost and try to count the birds ... they weren't successful. But the roost was vast.)

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Norfolk, Va.: Hi Mary: I loved your article! Your imagery is so lovely, and the information was wonderful. I, too, am a fan of crows and luckily have a small family (5-8) living in a huge old pine in my back yard. They seem to share space comfortably with a raccoon family living in a nearby dying maple and a squirrel lodge next door. Can you tell me, did you find from your research information on any vaccines or other methods of inoculation (medicated bait?) being developed to halt West Nile? Between outbreaks of rabies and West Nile in Va this year, I'm very worried about my "neighbors." Thanks, and my compliments on a great story! Lisa B.

Mary Battiata: Thanks for the kind words.

There is no vaccine at the moment. The Centers for Disease Control, the National Audubun Society (www.audubon.org), and Kevin McGowan (www.birds.cornell.edu/crows/westnile.htm) are all excellent sources of that kind of information about crows and West Nile Virus.

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Alexandria, Va.: I don't miss 'em at all. In our neighborhood, crows were making awful messes on our thrice-weekly trash collection days (exacerbated, however, by many households' refusal to use proper trash cans). I certainly can attest to the crow intelligence, though...those birds would spot trash bags being brought out from a couple hundred yards away and be on the ground within minutes of the person leaving.

Mary Battiata: It's remarkable how the covered plastic trash carts of the kind many local counties have adopted foil crows, raccoons, etc.

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Potomac, Md.: Interesting topic to write about, I mean, interesting in the fact that it is so normal and common in our everyday lives. A story about pidgeons next perhaps? Then one about gnats?

Mary Battiata: you'll have to tackle gnats.

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Elko Nevada: Great article!; The more the mainstream press reports favorably on these birds the better.
I wonder if West Nile is the culprit that is so often cited for the disappearance of crows. Is it possible that the food source became scarce and that crows move on. I lived in an isolated area for many years that had bunches of crows. When I moved the crows moved to a different area.

Mary Battiata: I think declines of 30 to 40 percent are thought too high to be attributable to any decline in food supply.

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Takoma Park, Md.: Regarding crows holding court. In my neighborhood there seemed to me two "families" of crows. Each family about 6-8 crows. A few years ago I woke up to increasingly loud cawing, then finally looked out of my window to see crows chasing another crow into my yard. One crow got the chased crow down on the ground on its back with the other crow pecking away at it. All the while the other crows were in a loose circle perched around the two crows cawing crazily--reminded me of Gladiator! I probably should have let them be but I ran out and clapped my hands to get them to disburse and let the lone pecked crow a change to get away. This year I have only seen 2-3 crows all year.

Mary Battiata: Crows unleashing hell. I'm told those territorial battles can get quite lethal.

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Covington,Va: I loved your article. As a crow lover on our farm we have watched 3 for over 30 years. I read they are recorded living as long as 80 years and they are part of the parrott group. We live on a bi centennial farm and no one has ever shot any. Do you have any info. So pleased you mentioned Sand Country Alamanac too. Anne Wright

Mary Battiata: Hello Covington. The longest lifespan I saw for crows in the wild is about 13 to 17 years. In the relatively more stable conditions of captivity lifespans of as long as 27 and 30 years have been record. Eighty years sounds too high.

Crows are corvids -- I don't believe they are part of the parrot family, but I could be wrong. They do have things in common: the curved bill, for example, and the talent for mimickry.

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Arlington, Va.: So enjoyed your article yesterday with my morning coffee. I was just wondering the other day why there seemed so few of them about this summer, there are usually dozens in the recreation center park's trees behind us. I've found the noise bothersome in the past, but can't imagine wanting to experminate them. Thumbs down to N. VA for their program, how short-sighted human beings are. After reading all the responses this morning I will never complain again, even when they drop their crud in the birdbath, or eat baby birds I've watched with bated breath getting ready to fly. That story of the bird in spaghetti sauce is priceless!
Come back crows, all is forgiven.

Mary Battiata: Fyi to everyone out there the crow poisoning is being carried out by the USDA's Wildlife Services division, which is the part of the USDA set up to deal with so-called predator species, i.e., animals that are regarded as a threat to livestock.

The process, evidently, is the following: local property owners complain to local government, who contact USDA< who must get a permit from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Services before proceeding.

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Oakton, Va.: I was glad to your article in todays paper because I too had noticed the depletion of crows in the area. However, after reading it I was rather disappointed. You turned an informative and to some extent investigative piece into animal rights propaganda. What did the quote about creation have to do with the crow problem or even their ability to adapt and survive? Also, I guess I?m the only one who can?t talk to animals like Dr. Doolittle. To say that you know the birds are saying, ?'He's got me! He's got me, too!' " is ludicrous. But then this is needed to make the close comparison to humans and even go so far as to suggest superiority in some instances. My guess is that if the crows survived the West Nile virus and humans did not, you wouldn?t be the least bit upset. And by the way, when I noticed there weren?t 20 crows in my backyard this summer, I was ecstatic.

Mary Battiata:
Glad if the article gave you some needed information about
local crow populations.

I disagree with your conclusions about the rest of it. For example, just to take one, I think McGowan's conclusion that the nestlings were communicating alarm to each other --"He's got me, he's got me, too!" -- while he had them in hand is based on years of observation and is thus warranted.

He is not sentimental about the birds, and neither am I, or at least I try not to be.

Thanks for writing.

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Arlington, Va.: Thanks for the article. I see someone today has asked about Fish Crows, our other crow species in this area.

A couple of years ago, before West Nile, I would hear the distinctive call of the Fish Crow in this area only rarely. Now when I hear crows around here, they're almost always Fish Crows.

My unsubstantiated theory is that Fish Crows are more resistant to W. Nile than Am. Crows. I am suggesting it to you in case you follow up on your excellent article. Maybe someone else has noted the same thing.

Mary Battiata: Thanks. There is evidence that fish crows are moving into upland terrain -- for example, they have begun appearing in the hilly upland woods of Alexandria, where previously they'd been creekside dwellers.

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Arlington, Va.: Thanks for that article on crows. I love them, they're such interesting birds. For the person who was interested in crows holding courts, they may also want to know that a group of ravens (a parliament), will have a gathering in which one bird talks in the middle for a while, and sometimes individuals in the crowd will talk back, as if asking questions. At the end either all the ravens will fly away, or fall upon the individual in the center and kill it. I don't know if crows and the corvidae family have any language to speak of, but they are fascinating birds. Thanks for the sympathetic portrait.

Mary Battiata: I heard a great raven story from Ann Clark, an ornithologist at Bingamton University. It concerns a hiker who broke her leg while traveling through the back-country somewhere out west. She was very moved when a raven appeared and proceeded to stay with her throughout her long ordeal of dragging herself back to civilization. She described how the raven circled over head, protectively she thought, and hopped along beside her.
None of the ornithologists who heard her tell the story later had the heart to tell her that the raven, noticing the broken leg, assumed she was done for, and was simply circling the area, waiting for her to die.

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Glover Park, Washington, D.C.: Thanks for your interesting article about crows! Great stuff in this discussion too.
Here in Glover Park we had what might have been considered a "roost" in the woods at the northern edge of our Glover Park Community Garden. Many, many crows gathered in the trees there. All gone now. Likewise they're no longer seen in the courtyard of our condo -- use to be many were there each am -- was like waking in the Amazon.

Mary Battiata: If yours was a seasonal roost, it will be interesting to see what autumn brings.

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Alexandria, Va.: I find crows interesting creatures, and I consider myself just an ordinary type citizen. Thanks for your eye-opening article. It's great that you've devoted the time and space to the subject!

I live in Parkfairfax, adjacent to the Beverly Hills community of which you write, in Alexandria. When I moved in last year, I nursed a fledgling crow - Edgar - inside my condo, feeding him watered down dog kibble and taking him out each day to encourage him to fly. He flew away after 2 weeks but I could have sworn he stayed nearby and even kept an eye on me all summer. You article seems to confirm my suspicious with the fascinating revelation that crows have a capacity for very good memory. My question: like the article suggests, I haven't seen any crows this year. Might there be any other explanation - besides death - for Edgar's failure to reappear this year?

Mary Battiata: Sure. It's possible that he mated this year, but found no open territory in your immediate area, and had to relocate to build a nest.

Or, once recovered, he could have flown back to spend the season with his parents and siblings.

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Columbia, Md.: Hi Mary,
I just wanted to thank you for the wonderful article on crows. I've always been fascinated with them and think of them as wise old spirits. They look so prehistoric swooping through the woods behind my house. And I get annoyed with people who refer to them as "junk birds," flying rats, etc. Until I read your article, I hadn't thought much about the fact that I haven't seen crows on my deck this summer, as in past years. I hear them cawing from a distance, but haven't actually seen many.
On the occasions when I have observed groups of crows kabitzing on the rail of my deck, which is tree canopy level, they seem to be very gregarious and fairly unthreatening to other birds--rather polite. They generall leave the other smaller birds alone at the feeder and keep to themselves at the other side. Not at all like the starlings and grackles that we refer to as the mafia of birdland.

I hope their numbers don't diminish too much and I thank you for your enlightening article.
Diane

Mary Battiata: That's interesting; very different behavior than that described by someone earlier here today, whose resident crows were lording over the songbird feeder.

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Woodbridge, Va.: Have you noticed the important part crows play in our folklore and art? Sometimes as a clever figure and sometimes something darker--maybe symbolizing death.

Unfortunately I can't remember the artists names, but I remember a famous German poem about crows flying in the winter sky--elegiac in tone--a total contrast to a calendar I bought last year with charming paintings of birds in imaginary scenes, including crows, wearing shoes and boots and conducting various amusing activities

Mary Battiata: I think you're right about that. I thought the Magazine's art director and staff found a great array of paintings and illustrations along those lines.

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Woodbridge, Va.: My sister and her husband had a pet crow when they lived in the Phillipines. It wasn't caged, but it came around for food, and learned to do tricks, like taking cigarettes from the packs in their shirt pockets.

Mary Battiata: Yes, the video of "Betty" the tool using New Caledonian crow shows the same kind of intelligence at work.

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Washington, D.C.: If you haven't already, I'd recommend going to see the movie "Winged Migration," a very beautiful and moving look at migratory birds.

Mary Battiata: ok thanks for the recommendation.

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Woodbridge Va.: I'm a little worried that some people may want to kill crows because they associate them with West Nile virus. It seems to me that a bird that dies so quickly of the disease would be relatively insignificant as a carrier. What do you think?

Mary Battiata: That is my understanding. Dried crow droppings are thought to pose no threat. However, one ornithologist told me that contact with any crow bodily fluid that is still wet -- including droppings -- could potentially be a danger to a human coming into contact, particularly if the human has a cut on the skin in the area of direct contact.

This kind of transmission is not yet well understood, however, but McGowan and his researchers do use rubber gloves to handle the nestlings.

I believe I am correct in saying there are no known cases of infected crows transmitting the virus to humans. All West Nile Virus cases in crows, humans and horses is thought to have been spread from infected mosquitos.

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Arlington, Va.: Thanks for your thoughtful article about crows. More than anything, I hope it highlights that no animals are inherently "good" or "evil," but that all have a right to exist whether it's in the woods or in your backyard (which probably was the woods a generation ago).

Speaking of: What can the average citizen do to stop intentional poisonings of these intelligent creatures? I find this extremely disturbing and I want to speak out.

Mary Battiata: Right.I think that was a point that McGowan and other scientists made in the piece.

Re the poisonings, the Humane Society of the United States and the local Audubon Naturalist's Society are monitoring the poisonings.

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Alexandria, Va.: I'm not an artist, but I've recently
composed a bagpipe tune entitled "A
Dearth of Crows" to pay homage to the
crow family that disappeared from my
back yard. I look to the future to bring
new friends to visit me while I practice.
Here's hoping the folks at Cornell are
right.

Any tips for goddies other than peanuts to
entice them?

Mary Battiata: Peanuts are the only ones I remember.
You might want to check out Kevin McGowan's site, or post a question to it about that.

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Sharon Springs, NY: Excellent article. Your comments re: wildlife/man interactions in urban/suburban America are very germaine. Wildlife managers have recently coined a term for it--wildlife acceptance capacity. Do you know the term? It may interest you as it is a subjective, social concept which has now become a driving factor in decision processes which were previously driven by the biological sciences. WAC was origionally coined at Cornell to manage state regulated species such as deer, racoons and recently bear. It is now being expanded in the for example the vulture permit (below) to justify the take of migratory birds. Might you expand your interest to other the actions of individuals and government concerning Black and Turkey Vultures -a permit to kill 4000 in VA has been sought fm the USFWS by VA-USDA-APHIS]? Are you aware of the annual winter crow shoot near Auburn, NY? Might you be aware of the proposed USFWS nationwide "management" plan for Double-crested Cormorants to protect aquaculture, sportfish and other "public resources" ? The Cormorant Plan, if/when adopted, will mark the first time that this country has taken/killed under the Migratory Bird Treaty Act one healthy, wild population for the benefit of another wild, healthy population. Previously, this has only been done to benefit endangered/threatened species. Again, nice piece on the crows. Peter

Mary Battiata: Thanks for your message. I'm keeping a copy of it. I had not heard the term WildLife Acceptance Capacity, and appreciate hearing about it.

I am aware of the permit pending for a kill of 4000 black and turkey vultures in the state of Virginia. My understanding is that the annual winter crow shoot in Auburn NY recently was abandoned, but I could be wrong about that. Interested parties could check with the town, I suppose. The shoot evidently was dreamed up by a local tavern and was coordinated by same for a while.

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Arlington, Va.: Hi. I loved the article. I've had the luck to get to know a family of blue jays that lived in my yard. They seem to be gone also. They'd completely tolerate me and often "hang out" just feet away when I was in the yard. It was great. Is west nile hitting them too?

Mary Battiata: Yes, the evidence so far indicates that crows and jays are the bird species hardest hit by West Nile Virus.

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Golden Valley, Minn.: We used to sit outside in blissfull silence, but when we let our cats ourside a number of crows would flock to the surrounding trees and start up a cacaphony of squawks, which terrorized 1 cat in particular. Once when there was a ruckous and that particular cat was late for dinner, I followed the squawks and found the cat cowering in some bushes, hiding from the crows that were perched on the surrounding shrubs.

Mary Battiata: Yes, crow flocks can drive predators like hawks away from nests and out of territory entirely when they have a mind to.

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Poisoning Crows: How can we get the government to stop poisoning crows? And why weren't they protected by the Migratory Bird Act?

Mary Battiata:
I don't know the answer to your question(s), but the Humane Society of the United Srates, and in particular, an official there named John Hadidian, might be a good reference for you.

The USDA's Wildlife Services division is a federal office set up to protect livestock from wild animal predation and the people there evidently were persuaded by Northern Virginia property owners that crow roosts were a serious problem.

My request for interviews and information with the federal officials directly involved in the poisoning program was routed to a USDA spokesman, who provided me with general information about the crow control program in N. Virginia, but had no specifics to offer about the sites and extent of the program, or the exact nature of the property damage that the crows were causing.

Getting more information might require filing FOIA request or something similar...

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Columbia, Md.: Just a quick question regarding your reply.
What has been your observation on crow behaviour with other species? Do you think some people are mistaking starlings and other more aggressive black birds for crows?
Or are my crows just more well-behaved for some reason?

Mary Battiata: I think it's possible some people might confuse a crow with a starling or a blackbird, for example. But I think it's even more likely that crow behavior varies from family to family, area to area, depending on the terrain, the food supply, the birds' population density and even individaul birds' personalities.

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Mary Battiata: That appears to be the last question. Thanks to everyone who wrote in.

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Mary Battiata: i'm wrong, there are a few more ... stand by

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Greenbelt, Md.: Thank you so much for the article. I'm a long time crow fan and could hardly believe my eyes when I picked up the Post magazine.
Two questions - how did you go about finding/choosing the art for the article (great paintings!) and do you know anywhere that people can register complaints about the crow poisonings?

Mary Battiata: The art was chosen by the Magazine's art staff -- art director Jay Porter, photo editor Keith Jenkins and assistant photo editor Jennifer Beeson,all under the taste and supervision of Post Magazine editor Tom Shroder. IT's the art director who shaped this particular issue. I thought it was beautiful, too.

Re poisonings and objections to: the Audubon Society, the Humane Society of the United States (John Hadidian in the Gaithersburg Md office) are places to start.

And people who are in favor of the crow control effort can always let their local and federal government representatives and officials know.

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Glenview, Ill.: Dear Mary,

I don't really have any questions.

I have been a crow fancier for close to 40 years. I watch them and I have raised them, as well. I have experienced the scratches on my arms, chest and calves from climbing hundreds of trees to retrieve a baby crow to take home to raise for a summer. They are fascinating as pets and extremely intelligent -- the stories I could tell.

What you wrote confirmed many of the things I have experienced over the years, including flocks from previous years recognizing me when I approached their nests to take the older of the fledglings - which also helped insure the younger babies survived. I have found many a nest with 5 to 7 babies or eggs. But, I have rarely seen any nests where more than 2 or 3 survived to experience their first flight, except when I took 1 or 2 of the older birds.

Last summer it was I who finally contacted the Audubon Society, after the press ignored me for weeks. I realized crows were dying off in huge numbers in the northern suburbs of Chicago. Audubon sent out 35 teams in early August to verify what I had deduced throughout July. It turned out to be devastating in this area, I presume because of the location of a regional set of mosquito infested lagoons which encompass several miles of forest preserve in this region.

It was also a sign of things to come. By mid-September this region was becoming the hardest hit region in the country. More human cases and deaths occurred in the northern Cook County suburbs, alone, than any State in the entire country.

I would love to share more stories and contact some of the people you wrote about. I might actually be able to contribute some data from my personal experiences. I would love the chance to work with people researching crows, as well. Since I am retired, I have the time.

But, I have been up all night and will likely be sleeping by noon tomorrow - 1:00 p.m. your time, when you come on line. So, I may not be able to participate in the live exchange. I would appreciate you forwarding any discussions you have in this forum or any contacts with information on crows.

Thanks

Mary Battiata: I believe that the Smithsonian Institution's Environmental Research Station, is busy with a program called Nestwatch, under the direction of scientist Peter Marra. This program enlists local homeowners, and birdwatchers, to keep data on local bird populations. YOu might find them an interesting resource. Also, on the internet, there is a site from a group called The Crow Project. According to their website, they are trying to put amateur ornithologists and their data in touch with scientists who might make use of it.

You might find some ornithologists who disagree with your practice of removing eggs from nests for non-scientific purposes, however. Also, I'm not sure that it's legal.

But it sounds like you've got a lot of data, some of it already useful as an early warning system on crow populations in the Cook County area.

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Alexandria, Va.: Great article... Yes, it is silent this year where I live too, I miss those wonderful, raucus crows terribly. I realize I can't stop the West Nile killing but what can I do to stop the Gov't from poisoning them? Many were poisoned a few blocks from my residence last year and I don't want that to happen again. I don't understand humans sometimes, humans make more noise and mess than these birds. Sarah

Mary Battiata: See previous reply re Humane Society of the U.S. (Gaithersburg Md office) and the Audubon Naturalists Society (Chevy Chase, Md.)

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Front Royal, Va.: This is a comment rather than a question. One time, when I used to have a vegetable, the corn I planted was raided by crows. Somehow they seemed to know exactly where each seed was located n the ground. Down each row were small indentations where the crow(s) plucked out the seed. The rest of the soil was undestrubed. The did the same thing to a second planting. Fresh corn from the garden is one of my favorite vegetables. Needless to say, I was very upset. With stealth, I killed one of the crows and hung his body on a pole next to the corn. I had no more corn stolen after that. They learn fast.

Tom

Mary Battiata: Now that's a scarecrow.

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Alexandria, Va.: Just watching the crows is so entertaining. I don't understand why they seem to be the targets of so much human hate and violence; they're quite harmless, smart and friendly left reasonably undisturbed.

I think you may not have adequately pointed the finger at the government (at all levels) in the very sad disappearance of the crows. The USDA/VDAC "nuisance animal" mass-killing projects and the use of highly-toxic bird-killing chemicals have really done these poor creatures in.

Mary Battiata: Ornithologists in this area agree that the double whammy of West Nile Virus and USDA crow control/poisoning has been very bad for Northern Virginia crow populations.

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Silver Spring, Md.: Where did you get the idea that there is more forest cover in the eastern United States today that 300 years ago, where there were almost no people here? And if there is more forest cover today, and thus more natural wildlife habitat, then wouldn't it follow that there would be fewer deer, foxes, waterfowl, etc. living in urban and suburban areas, rather than more?

Mary Battiata: The idea is that much of the eastern United States was clear cut in the 18th and 19th centuries for agriculture. That process began reversing itself in the second half of the 20th century.

There is more forest, and there also is more urban and suburban development. Those urban and suburban areas have more constant and abundant food resources than a forest area might (unlike a rural agricultural area, where cornfields and other features can support large crow populations).

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Mary Battiata: That does seem to be the last question. Thanks for reading and writing in.

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