Life at Work Live

Amy Joyce

Washington Post columnist Amy Joyce writes Life at Work on Sundays in the Business section and appears online every Tuesday to offer advice about managing interpersonal issues on the job.

The transcript follows below.

Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.

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New York City: Hi, Amy -
I am a huge fan. I read your columns, have read your book, and attribute my last promotion to a lot of the advice you've provided me (thank you!;). but after reading Sunday's column, I felt I had to write you. I am traumatized by it. First of all, I am a (decent-looking, if it matters) female middle manager (after the aforementioned promotion) and I find that many of my superiors flirt with me mercilessly. Harmlessly, sure, but incessantly. I have done my best to be kind, but shut down any type of flirting. I turn away when I feel probing eyes, or when I feel someone is talking to my chest, I return the look with a cold stare in their eyes. I just can't be like that. I'm married, they're married, and quite frankly, I like to work at work. Don't get me wrong, I go on business trips, and socialize adequately, but I am talking about AT the office. (Not to say I flirt outside of the office only, but that I am more "social" outside.) I am not stand-offish, but kind and friendly, but I do not encourage the flirting. To make a longer story short, I feel like your column Sunday said that this is bad practice. (I've thought a lot about this!;) I feel like I need to put out (not literally) more of an effort on the "cute/flirty" front, so that I can appear pleasant. I read your column to mean that a business woman with savvy smarts is one thing, but to get there, you'd best put your best flirt forward. And now I think I've approached this whole thing all wrong. Do you think I should bat my eyelashes a little more? Honestly?

Amy Joyce: Hi, NYC. Thanks. And PLEASE read that column again. I'm certainly not saying women can get ahead by flirting. Or, well, by other things. I found it a bit infuriating just how over the top these women on the Apprentice were, using their sexuality to get ahead, although it did cause them to win their task. As I said in the column, even Donald Trump chided them for stepping over the sexuality line, and pointed out they could and should win by using their brains. Period.
You're doing it right: you're not standoffish, but kind and friendly. I think the most important above all is to be a confident woman who speaks her mind. No need to do as the Apprentice ladies do. But since they are winning, it sure does raise some questions, doesn't it?

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Security Clearence Question:: I currently hold a clearence but recently I've been in a depressive funk because I've had some deaths in the family. I have access to some great counciling resources, but I'm hesitent to contact them because I'm not sure how it will affect my clearence since you have to report that stuff. FWIW, everything else relating to my clearence (no $$ problem, no drugs/alcohol issues, job performance good, no clandestine dealings with bad guys) is spotless. Because the market is so crappy unless you have a clearence, I'm totally worried about doing anything that would result in Big Brother yanking mine. I'm not sure if my paranoia is valid, or simply due to ignorance in how clearences are processed/reviewed, so I'd be interested in if there are any knowledgable people(DoD adjucators, etc.)lurking in the audience that could shed light. I mean, I'd like to talk to somebody about what I'm going through, but not at the expense of loosing my job...yikes!;

Amy Joyce: I'm going to throw this out there for any lurkers with some advice.
But here's my two cents:
You are potentially depressed. If you don't talk to someone or treat it, you could land yourself in a lot more trouble. I really hope our government wouldn't deny someone clearance who is doing something as important as getting some couseling, especially after such life changing events as deaths in the family.

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Farragut North, DC: I'm submitting early b/c I can't be around for the live chat. I started a new job not too long ago, and my boss is incredibly passive-aggressive. So much so that its difficult to work with her and I've started looking for another job. She has told me that my work is outstanding, so it makes it that much harder to deal with the p-a stuff. I want to try and talk to her about this, but I can't figure out a nice way to ask her to stop. Or is talking to her a bad idea in the first place? Her boss has asked me, very nonchalant, if I am happy here and if I have any problems to talk to her about them. I would take her up on that, but she is very p-a too, and I think it would fall on deaf ears. Has anyone else been able to deal with this successfully? Since starting this job I've found out that I am the 4th person in this position in 18 months time and I think the p-a might be the reason behind the turnover.....

Amy Joyce: If you're looking for a new job anyway, I say talk. By not talking, you're also becoming passive aggressive in a way, yes?
You can call her on things when she's saying them. "By that, what exactly do you mean?" Or sit her down and say you're tough enough and can handle criticism. Tell her you can't really guess what she wants. The clearer she is, the better off you'll all be. I don't think that would be a majorly detrimental discussion to have. At this point, it seems like you should probably just take that chance.

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Tysons: Hi Amy-

I have a second interview today at noon!; Any last minute advice?? Thanks!;

Amy Joyce: Check the mirror, take a deep breath. Make sure you have pertinent questions to ask. Smile, be yourself. Listen. And congrats on that second interview!

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Mississauga, ON, Canada: Dear Amy,

I work in the pharmaceutical industry. Late last year, there were many personnel changes in my department and I inherited a number of projects from my predecessor.

As a result, original receipts submitted by a physician ("Dr. X")who did some work for the company have been misplace. I had photocopies of the recipts (for parking, food accomodation, etc).

The originals disappeared in the all of the restructuring and the accounts payable department would not reimburse Dr. X without them.

So, I rang his secretary, who was an absolute star, who moved heaven and earth to get new receipts to me. I can't imagine it'd be easy to get a new receipt from say, Starbucks or an airport parking lot.

To thank the secretary, I sent her some flowers (50 $ worth) along with a thank you note.

Turns out new rules regarding appropriate / inappropriate gift-giving came into effect on Jan 1. Sending a present to a person in a physician's employ is considered bribery.

Management has called me in for a meeting... I am terrified.

Any advice?

Amy Joyce: Seems like you need to tell them exactly what you told us here. Apologize, but explain. And tell them it won't happen again. It seems like a reasonable explanation to me. Good luck.

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Bowie, MD: Hi Amy,
I am hoping for some feedback from you and the others. I am part of a small staff and supervise a couple of people. For the most part, everyone gets along very well and it is a pleasant work environment. However, there is one employee, "John", who is consistently between 10 and 45 minutes late every day. I asked his supervisor (who is on the same level as me) about this and he says that it's okay because John always stays late to make up the time. I have not done/said anything else since he is John's boss, not me. But there is a good chance that I will be taking over John's supervision in the next couple months, and I want to address it. True, the tardiness rarely causes a major problem with our scheduling, but my feeling is that if everyone else is expected to be on time, he should too. Important side note- there is no pressing reason for his being late- he just doesn't manage his time well in the mornings.

Am I being anal about this? Is it not a big deal? I need suggestions for how to confront something that has been accepted for years while still maintaining a harmonious work environment. Thanks.

Amy Joyce: First of all, it seems like it's none of your business yet. Worry about it when you become his supervisor. Second, if John stays late, do 10 minutes in the morning really matter? You can talk to him about it (when you are his supervisor), but perhaps there is a good reason, and it sounds like he is conscientious enough to make sure he stays late. It's up to you how to handle it, but I sort of think, unless he's really throwing everything off by being late in the morning, a little flexibility can go a long way.

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Los Angeles, CA: Hi Amy,

I'm in a bit of a mess. I was told after my probation that I wasn't 'fitting in' the office. I have been given a month to find a new position but am quite distraught.

I was hired because they wanted someone 'lively' in the office who was personable. But it seems as if all the qualities that made them hire me make me a bad fit for the office. I tried to fit in by behaving like the other staff and it STILL didn't make them happy.

I'm not a trouble maker but I want to talk to HR about my review and maybe transferring to another department. I'm worried that my department will think that I'm trying to go over their head and i'll be terminated.

I'm so stressed that I know I'm not thinking straight. Can you offer some advice?

Thank you

Amy Joyce: Breathe. Do you actually enjoy this place? I can't imagine you do. They are giving you a month to find work. Perhaps you can negotiate for a little more time, but I think I would get out there and start looking for a job that is a better fit for both you and the employer.
It probably wouldn't hurt to talk to HR, and ask if you can write up a rebuttal on your review. Most managers don't mind that, and it's sometimes just a smart thing to do, so your records show your side of the story.

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PC (Pentagon City!;): Hi, Amy. I've been in the working world (full time, that is) for two and a half years now, and I've hit a wall. I've been progressing well professionally (I'm working to develop into a manager and will be there by year's end), but I now feel like I don't want to work anymore. I don't think it's my job because I honestly can't think of anything I'd rather be doing. I know you had a book out that was more for entry-level folks, but I think I'm beyond those woes (thankfully). How can I deal with this quarter-life crisis? Is it normal?

Amy Joyce: I'd say it's normal. And I'd say it sounds like you're probably bored out of your skull. What will help is getting out to see what else you can do. There are a ton of opportunities available. Try a few networking events in the area. Go volunteer at a non-profit both to meet people, and especially, to do some good work which can put you in a new frame of mind. In other words, don't just sit there. Do something.
It's only been 2.5 years. You need to see what else is out there. Start thinking about what it is that can sustain your interest, and what you have to share with the greater world.
Good luck.

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Md.: keep in mind, what one person views as passive-aggressive could be another person's way of giving a hint without coming off too strongly. or it could be an introverted boss who is trying to deal with an extroverted employee!!!!!! perception is everything, of course, but in general it is the employee's responsibility to clarify instructions and figure out what the boss wants/means

Amy Joyce: Yuck, yuck, yuck. No excuse for PA in my book. Tell me when I'm doing something wrong. Point things out when I'm doing something right. Passive aggressiveness only leads to bad things... many people can't read what it is a boss is trying to mime, and it only causes problems for the employee, and of course, for the boss.
The employee guesses wrong, the boss gets more frustrated. (Why didn't she understand when I told her the project she turned in was *good* was actually too sloppy??)
No hints in the workplace. (I'm sure there are exceptions, but I'm very hard pressed to think of any.)

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Arlington: The Time-Clock Supervisor: If it doesn't effect work and no one is really being harmed by his being 15 minutes late (especially if he is a salaried employee), then being the school marm watching the time isn't going to be an effective supervision strategy.

I was struck by the comment that "he didn't have a good reason" and didn't manage time well. How is that different from a working mom who is late? The pregnant woman with morning sickness? How is that different from a commuter stuck in traffic? Ultimately, their lateness isn't good time management, yet apparantly those are fine excuses.

Ultimately, if no one else's work is hindered by someone being late, the work is done, the time is made up, and it's only 15 minutes, why not treat everyone like an adult (espcially if they are a salaried employee) and focus supervisory energies on something else.

Amy Joyce: That sounds about right to me. Seems like a manager's time can be spent in much better ways.

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Baltimore: geez. can we say "controlling?"

I work in an office where we have an employee who is a clock watcher when it comes to other people. He knows when they get in, he knows when they leave. However, we are salaried, and our jobs have little interaction, so my coming in at 10 or leaving at 9 has no effect on anyone else.

The only problem is the angst that the clockwatcher causes. At the end of the day, if I am doing the job for which I was hired, what does it really matter when it gets done?

People need to stop treating others like they are kindergartners. Life sometimes interferes - would you rather have a good employee who works hours that are not ideal for you, or a crappy employee who is there from 8-5 on the dot but doesn't do one iota over what the job requirements are?

Amy Joyce: Amen to that. A little flexibility goes a long way. If an employee has a boss who watches the clock for them, I feel like they will be much less apt to just dig in and do their work. They'll be too worried about the time.

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RE: New York City: I think the issue this woman raises is incredibly important as attitudes and behaviors change in today's workplace. What I think is most interesting about the Apprentice is that the challenges are all geared toward short-term, immediate success. Obviously, given the format, there is no way to track the teams over a long period of time - let's face it, everyone would get bored and the show wouldn't be successful. So can "sex" succeed in the short term? Sure. Does it work in the long run? Never. And the fact is, that it can only get you so far. Look at all the women at the top if you want proof.

Amy Joyce: Exactly the point of my column. Those sorts of tactics never last. Thank goodness...

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Alexandria, VA: Hi Amy,

I have informed my manager that I have accepted another job, and things have turned really, really ugly. To the point she's made threats about providing references and that I 'owe' it to them to stay for the full two weeks. I had originally given her a two weeks notice, but after her attitude and the way she has handled this, I've decided to resign this Friday. Aside from talking to upper management about this, what else can I do to document that her behavior was the cause for my decision to leave earlier than scheduled? Also, as a side question, isn't the two weeks notice more of a quideline, not a 'have-to?' Thanks for your help

Amy Joyce: Yes, the two-weeks thing is a guideline, but a kind one. I'm not sure leaving Friday is such a great idea. I would guess if you do that, she certainly won't give you a good reference. Usually, I suggest people give at least two weeks' notice, and offer their telephone number to help with the transition after they leave and their replacement comes in. I'm not sure if you can patch things up, but you might want to try. It can only help you in the long run. Tell your boss you're sorry she feels that way, but you're trying to make it as easy on her as possible. Good luck.

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Washington, D.C.: Amy, I've exhausted my unemployment benefits and now face having to resort to temp work. This is such a depressing prospect that I can't get psyched to approach it with a positive attitude. I was in a mid-management position until being laid off last year.

Any suggestions?

Amy Joyce: I'm very sorry. Yours is a story of many these days. But listen, there are a lot of high level temp jobs out there these days. And many of them will lead to full-time work when the economy turns around. A lot of companies are using temps now so they can sort of test them out before agreeing to hire full-time. It's just what they're doing in this economy to ensure they are making smart hiring decisions. Make sure to tell your temp firm that you hope to become full-time. They can help you get a temp-to-permanent placement in many cases.
Meanwhile, I'd love to talk to you a little further. Can you email me at lifeatwork@washpost.com?
Good luck.

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Re: Bowie: You said "Important side note- there is no pressing reason for his being late- he just doesn't manage his time well in the mornings."

Are you sure? Maybe there is a reason that he's late but that he has only shared it with the boss because it is personal. I had a co-worker who was late daily for a while--I wasn't concerned about the hours he was working, but I found out much after the fact that his child was having some mild health problems that took some time to deal with every morning. Eventually his child outgrew the problem. Our boss was flexible with himsince she knew his work would get done, and 30 minutes in the a.m. didn't really make a difference in his work productivity or the running of the office. And in retrospect, I appreciate that the boss was flexible with my coworker when he needed it. No matter what the co-worker has told you, you just may not know the real reason why he's late....

Amy Joyce: This is a good point. And it really gets me that this person who wrote in said this, but isn't his supervisor. It's really no one's business but this employee and his own manager.

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Arlington, VA: Grief counseling and treatment for depression does not automatically lead to a clearance revocation or denial. Reading your post I dont see any problems. Go to counseling and get some help. Just let your FSO or govt security manager know since you are required to as part of your responsibility of holding a clearance.
Finally be honest and truthful with any paperwork or interviews.
A DOD adjudicator

Amy Joyce: Thanks.

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"Late" employees: Where I work there is an employee who has trouble getting to work before 930. I have a problem with this because everyone else is here earlier, but our meetings are later for the one person who has said "I could get here earlier, but I don't want to". I'm all for people doing their own jobs and having their own lives, but there's no reason to have it come down on everyone else for one individual - which it does here.

Amy Joyce: Yes, if it affects the entire office, then it's not a good thing. But if it affects nothing but someone's clock-watching habits, I think it's fine as long as he/she is doing the work.

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Bay Area: I have applied to a full-time graduate program and intend to return to school in the fall. My former boss knew of my plans and wrote a recommendation for me. Since that time, I've been promoted to a completely new position in a new department and have a new boss. I'm torm about whether to let my new boss know of my plans. So far I've kept my intentions to myself so that I can get to know her and the new job without being considered a short-timer, but it's beginning to feel a bit dishonest since yearly plans and objectives are being developed. Should I just come out with it?

Amy Joyce: Your former boss may have already told this boss of your plans. Is that possible? I guess if you are 100 percent sure you're going back to school in the fall, then go ahead and tell your new boss. But a lot can change between now and then. You might want to wait a month or two before you decide to tell. In fact, why don't you go back and ask your old boss for some advice? After all, he/she knows the place, and will likely have some pertinent insight for you.

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Re:Security Clearance: Talk to your security officer. I know 10 years ago, the issue was if you don't tell them if you went on medication... Some medications might be a red flag, but I am sure most aren't.

I am sure talk therapy - grief counseling - would be be encouraged. The last thing the government needs is someone guarding the nations' assets in a distraught, potentially careless state of mind. Your good mental health is in the government's best interest, but like I said, talk to your security officer. This will be nothing new to him/her.

Amy Joyce: Thanks, this seems smart.

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Rockville, Md: Amy, the posting about the clock watcher is very appropriate. I work with adults. No youngsters. I don't think having someone watch the clock and then report to his/her supervisor is the way to run an office. In fact, it creates bad feelings, especially for what amounts to a few minutes, give or take a few. If you are getting your job done and not affecting anyone elses, it shouldn't happen

Amy Joyce: I like your way of thinking.

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Arlington, VA: I just wanted to drop a note to the person who has the person who is perpetually running late into the office. In my office, our boss is absolutely rigid about start times - and it drives him crazy when people are five minutes late to work. He's been known to tell people that they should call if they're going to be two minutes late - even if these are people who regularly work through lunch, stay late, and come in on weekends. It makes for a really oppressive office atmosphere, because the perception is that we're not adults. It's my feeling that unless this person's lateness either causes problems for the rest of the team (like they can't start until he's in), or it's become a point of resentment for others in the company because he's percieved as a slacker who doesn't do his time, then let it go. It makes life easier. Maybe he's just not a morning person, and doesn't mind staying past 6pm to finish up the day. I think so long as work is getting done, don't micromanage people's time...

Amy Joyce: And more...

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Salt Lake City, UT: Hi Amy,

I work at a company where the vast majority of employees are underpaid relative to the rest of the industry, based on a recent salary survey. Since we work in Utah, it seems natural to be paid less than, say, someone in DC or Los Angeles. I am paid about $10k below the nationwide average for my position (about $20k under the average in California). However, one of my coworkers is paid under -half- the national average for their salary.

How should this employee confront an employer with this data, and would it be wise to do so requesting a raise? My hunch is that if my friend applied to a job out of state and threatened to leave the company, management would realize they need him urgently enough to give him a substantial raise. Unfortunately, without that threat, he has repeatedly been ignored during salary reviews. Thanks - and I love your column!;

Amy Joyce: I'm not big into "other job offer" threats. They often backfire. But if you believe you have earned a higher salary, and have the data to back that up, it seems very reasonable to go in to your boss and explain that. See what the options are. You might be surprised how they can find a few extra bucks. Good luck to you adn your co-worker.

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Washington, DC: Good morning Amy.

I need your advice. I am currently employed and am in an active job search and may accept another job soon. I am prepared to leave the same day I receive an offer from another company (work assignments at my current postion are done and my boss is really rude to employees who resign). How should I handle my resignation if I want to leave immediately. I was thinking of handling it the same way companies handle terminations---i.e. wait until 5:00 on the day I am leaving and present my resignation letter and keys then send an upbeat email to my co workers. Is this a good idea??? NOTE: giving longer notice will not prevent burned bridges because my boss takes resignations as a personal insult and he makes life impossible for resigning employees.

Amy Joyce: Sorry, I don't care if your boss takes things personally and makes life miserable for resigning employees. You can bet this boss will truly make your life difficult if this goes down the way you're suggesting. Please reconsider, do as I suggested a little earlier in the discussion. Even if your boss takes it personally and tries to make your life miserable, at least you know *you* handled it professionally. If your new employer (or any potential employer) hears how you quit and left so abruptly, they will fear they could be next. What's that old addage? Two wrongs...

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Falls Church, Virginia: To Washington, DC Temp-to-Be:

Temping Rocks!; Amy's right-on: Temporary staffing
agencies are now the "try before you buy" option for
everybody. It's the easiest way in the door. I'll be
more than happy to be a cheerleader for you if you
want.

Amy Joyce: You are already quite the cheerleader. Temping has become a very popular way to gain a full-time job, or simply gain different experiences. And it's not looked down upon as it once was. Check out my column on this topic from (I think) two weeks ago.

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Ashburn, VA: Amy, you mention quite a few times that people should attend networking events. Sorry, but I don't have a clue as to where to even find one. Please help. I desperately want to get out of my current job and into another company, and I know it can't be done without networking.

Also, any advice for networking when you're an introvert? I just get this image in my head that they are full of extroverts trying to talk over each other!;

Thanks

Amy Joyce: Networking can seem like a scary thing when you're an introvert. But that's the great thing: It's a networking event. Everyone is there with one purpose in mind, and that is to meet people. And I can tell you, very few people get excited to go and talk to strangers. But when it's over, you'll be glad you did. Promise yourself when you go that you'll meet two people or that you'll get two business cards by the end of the event. My guess is you'll end up with much more than that. These events are created to make it easy to talk to strangers. You'll be placed at a table with five other people. Or they will have a meet and greet that makes it painless to say hi, say what you do, and give your card to someone.
As for where to look? Not to be self-serving here, but read the Business section. These networking groups are often mentioned. Then you can check out their web sites for events. A few that pop to mind: the Northern Virginia Tech Council, Tomorrow's Leaders Today, Women of Washington, Washington Women in Public Relations, justshowup.com...
A lot of times, there are calendar listings as well in this paper, and the events are listed there. Check out your local Chamber of Commerce, too.

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Amy Joyce: My goodness, how time flies. Please join again next week, same time, same place. Have a great week....

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washingtonpost.com: Amy Joyce will return next week, Tuesday, Feb. 17 at 11 a.m. Please join her then. Thanks for participating today.

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