Transcript: Democratic Candidates Debate in South Carolina

BROKAW: Congressman, thank you very much.

Senator Kerry, can you look the good people of South Carolina in the eye and say, "If you elect me president, we'll turn back the clock. You're going to get all of those textile manufacturing jobs back. We're going to change the equation in this country, and they won't be producing the goods in Malaysia or in China or in Mexico if I'm the president of the United States"?

But here's what I can say to them: I will be a president who's on the side of workers in this country to provide the American worker with a fair playing field, to provide the American worker with a fair shot to be able to compete. Because that's not what they have today.

They have a president who's selling their jobs out to large corporations, whether it's the drug companies or the oil industry, who's not fighting for real people and the lives they lead on a daily basis.

I was at Midlands Community College today. Fritz Hollings helped create as governor a network of community colleges that are technical, that help train people.

This administration is backing off that kind of technical training. They turned around and gave $120 million of technical training, when they cut a billion dollars over the course of the last few years. That's like kicking down the barn door and saying, "Here are some twigs. Rebuild it."

We need a president who's going to fight for trade that's fair. We need a president who's going to close the loopholes of these corporations that have a reward, Tom, to take the jobs overseas.

I'm going to go to the tax code that's gone from 14 pages to 17,000 pages, and we're going to take out any benefit, any reward, any incentive, for any Benedict Arnold company or CEO to take American jobs overseas and stick the American people with the bill. And that's what we need to do.

BROKAW: Senator Edwards, is it realistic to talk to the American people about stopping the global economy and the movement toward it, of manufacturing overseas a lot of these piece goods and other products that were manufactured here for many years, and it's not going to come back?

EDWARDS: No, it's not the truth. We can have a real impact on the loss of jobs. We can do something to bring jobs back to replace the jobs that we've lost.

But we can't stop it entirely. What John just said about that's exactly right.

But I want to say that this personal to me.

You know, 40 miles from here, when I was born 50 years ago, my parents brought me home to a mill village, to a textile mill village. I have seen this my entire life growing up.

I've seen mills close, I've seen what it does to communities, I've seen what it does to families.

And all this talk among politicians in Washington about, "We're going to get you job retraining program, we're going to make sure that we give you the transportation to get to a new job," say that to a 50- or 55-year-old man who's been supporting his family his entire life working in a mill.

I think the truth of the matter is, we need to start by recognizing the pain. And not just the economic pain -- the pain that these families are in.

I mean, we have to fight hard to protect our jobs better for some of the reasons others have already talked about. We need to close loopholes in our tax code to give breaks to companies that are leaving, give tax breaks to American companies that will keep jobs here.

BROKAW: Let ask General Wesley Clark about a development in Washington today. The White House announced that -- whoops -- the new Medicare prescription drug bill is going to cost a third more than they originally said. And the deficit this next year is going to be more than $500 billion more than. The CBO office says that, in fact, in the next 10 years, that this prescription drug Medicare benefit bill could cost as much as a trillion dollars.

If you were the president of the United States, would you tear it up and start all over again?

CLARK: Well, I would start all over with a lot of things this administration has done, Tom.

BROKAW: But let's start with this one.

CLARK: And let me start at the...

(APPLAUSE)

Just to get into this. What we've got is a runaway deficit in the United States of America right now. And what we need to do is take back to the federal government the resources we need.

This prescription drug benefit is an important benefit, if it's done right, for our seniors. But to do it right, you've got to bargain competitively with the pharmaceutical companies and lower the prices. You've got to stop giving a handout to the HMOs. You've got to take Medicare out of competition with the HMOs. And you've got to close the donut hole.

I think with the right leadership in Washington, we can fix this Medicare prescription benefit for our seniors.

It's just about leadership. And that's what this president doesn't show in Washington on our economy.

BROKAW: Reverend Sharpton, should wealthy Americans or people who are well off, for that matter, pay more for their Medicare benefits? Should we begin now a real test of means and apply it to the Medicare costs that are beginning to run exponentially out of control?

SHARPTON: I think they should pay their share, which is more. I think that when you have the present set-up that you have and you go above $80,000 and they pay nothing, I think that is absolutely ridiculous. I think that they must pay their share.

And, you know, it's absurd to me for people to come and look at the people in South Carolina in the face and say, "It's an honor for your sons and daughters to go abroad and die for others. But it is a burden for rich people to pay their tax at home." I mean, you can't have it both ways. Either all of us...

(APPLAUSE)

... should be honored to sacrifice or none of us should.

In terms of jobs, I want to address that. We need to create jobs. Not only do we need to rescind NAFTA -- and I think we must rescind it. You can't correct it. It has cost jobs. It has sent jobs from this state to Asia and other places.

This president has increased the deficit, has not increased jobs and is embracing the rich at the expense of working class and poor people.

And it's double in communities of color. Black unemployment in this state is double. We face class and race. I don't think we can tolerate that four more years.

BROKAW: Senator Kerry, the last time that we met, or at least I was involved in one of these debates, you were very tough on Governor Dean, challenging him to come out against cutting back on the growth rate of Medicare.

Aren't today's numbers one more demonstration that we're going to have to do something about the rate of growth in these entitlement programs, or my grandchildren and yours are going to carry a very, very heavy burden in the future?

KERRY: Well, Tom, you don't cut the benefits to people that you've promised. You can do things to guarantee that you keep Medicare solvent, as we've done. We did that in the United States Congress. And we did it with respect to Social Security.

And this president wants to privatize Social Security, which will in fact make it more at risk than it is today.

One of the things we haven't talked about yet, if you want to talk about how we're going to help people, the critical issue on the minds of most people in South Carolina and across the country is health care costs themselves.

KERRY: Oh, OK. Well, I thought I'd just...

(LAUGHTER)

Because that's part of the solution to the Medicare problem, is the overall -- for instance, in Medicare, 55 percent, 50 percent of the cost is going to 5 percent of the people for Alzheimer's. If we had a medical care system in this country that dealt better with research, with prevention, with wellness, with the whole parameter of health care issues, we could begin to reduce the costs of Medicare.

The problem is, this administration has only one plan: savings accounts for people who are able to save -- that's it.

That's not a plan.

I have a plan that will provide health care to all Americans, that will lower the cost of health care for Americans, and I think that's a critical way to save Medicare and strengthen the entire health care system of our country.

BROKAW: We want to continue this discussion about entitlements and what they're costing the society and talk about health care as well.

We'll be back from Greenville, South Carolina, in just a moment.

BROKAW: We're back at the Peace Center for Performing Arts in Greenville, South Carolina. The South Carolina primary and six others are next Tuesday.

And we have been talking about the cost of entitlements in this country, Social Security and Medicare and all the other entitlement programs, as well as health care. We're going to continue that conversation now.

During the break, Governor Dean said to me that this is so mellow.

Well, Governor, we're in the South, where there's premium on politeness...

(LAUGHTER)

(APPLAUSE)

... so I'm going to invite you to stir it up here a little bit, if you'd like to.

We were talking just a few moments ago about the Medicare prescription drug benefits bill. Just let me read to you a couple of numbers that the CBO, the Congressional Budget Office, has come out with.

Well beyond the next 10 years, which is the projection now going on, they believe that it could cost up to $1.2 trillion in the second 10 years. It could be as much as $190 billion in the year 2023 alone.

You don't have to be a math wiz to know that that will break this country and break the spirit of the generation coming along.

You disagree?

DEAN: No, I think that's right. But I also think that Bill Clinton showed that when you improve the economy and get people jobs, then you increase payroll taxes and you make these funds more solvent.

Continued