McCain: Americans Divided, Dissatisfied over U.S. Foreign Policy

Interviewee: John McCain

Interviewer: Robert McMahon, Deputy Editor

December 7, 2007

A leading Republican candidate for president of the United States, Sen. John McCain (R-AZ), has carved out a position as a strong backer of the military surge in Iraq and comprehensive immigration reform at home. A month before the presidential primary season began, McCain said Americans should plan to have a large deployment of troops in Iraq "for quite a period of time." And he said an immigration plan involving temporary-worker provisions and settlement of illegal alien status is still necessary but not likely to be revisited until 2009.

Senator, Iraq was once considered the defining issue of this election campaign, but it's now barely discussed on the campaign trail. Is this one of the consequences of the surge and is this a good thing?

It's a good thing for America that we are succeeding after the Democrats had declared the war lost, [Senate Majority Leader] Harry Reid (D-NV) did and others. So it's a good thing in the respect that our success has lessened the visibility of the issue. But I would make two points. One is that the [congressional] Democrats are still trying to cut off funding and force withdrawal, which then would reverse all the successes that we have achieved and cause chaos and genocide in the region and al-Qaeda would be winning again. It's not over, al-Qaeda is on the run, they're not defeated. And the battle goes on with the Democrats, who declared the war lost when clearly the facts on the ground indicate that we are succeeding.

In your own party, you have sparred recently with [presidential candidate] Ron Paul (R-TX) about the issue. He gets his share of cheers at debates on his noninterventionist message and call for withdrawal of forces from Iraq. Does this reflect some splintering in the Republican Party or the loss of some of your more independent backers?

Congressman Paul is very adroitly exploiting a vein of dissatisfaction amongst the American people and it has to do with corruption and spending in government. It has to do with inefficiencies in government. It has to do with the trait of isolationism, which has had an influence in this country literally ever since Teddy Roosevelt, when we decided to become a player on the world stage. And because of that isolationism we have paid a very heavy price throughout history, most notably, obviously, the rise of Hitler. But he is doing a good job of tapping that vein of anger and dissatisfaction, not just about the war but about the government, about our broken borders, about the IRS [Internal Revenue Service], about a tax system that's clearly broken. And he has got a very fervent group of followers. I don't think it's a very large group but certainly a very dedicated group of followers.

For how long should Americans be prepared to have sizeable forces in Iraq?

For quite a period of time, but I don't think that will affect American support for the war. American casualties will be the key. We've had troops in Bosnia for a long time. We've had troops in South Korea, Japan, etc. Americans are perfectly satisfied with that because we aren't losing Americans in those places. If we can get the casualty rate down and the Iraqi military taking on more and more of the responsibilities, then Americans will be at least accepting of an American presence in Iraq for a long time, but that is definitely in a support and training role over time.

Moving next to Iran, this week's NIE findings suggest that there is, in fact, a 'rational actor' in Tehran that can be influenced by sanctions and international pressure. Do you agree and should we make a diplomatic effort along the lines of North Korea with Iran?

We should continue to have communications with the Iranians. There's many capabilities for doing so, including the meetings in Iraq, [in which] the Iranian ambassador was there and our ambassador was there. I do not wish to legitimize any further or enhance the credibility of a nation that is still dedicated to the extinction of the state of Israel, that is still supporting terrorist organizations such as Hezbollah and Hamas, and a country that is exporting the most lethal explosive devices into Iraq, killing young Americans. If there is establishment of negotiations that have a positive outcome, then obviously none of us would object to such a thing but I don't want to give the president of Iran a forum to declare his rather radically extreme views particularly as regards to terrorism and the state of Israel is concerned.