Talking About Torture

"SCHIEFFER: Well, for example, will this prohibit making people stand up for long periods of time? Because I know in your captivity -- what? -- you were once made to stand up for two days, or something?

"Sen. McCAIN: Yeah. It's hard for me to get into these techniques. First of all, I'm not privy to them, but I only know what I've seen in public reporting. But some of these, such as an extreme stress position and extreme application of that I think would be -- would be certainly important. . . .

"Mr. HARRIS: What gives you the confidence? The last time you reached an agreement, it was in law, the administration signed it, and then put out a signing statement saying it was going to interpret it its own way. Did you have confidence as you were negotiating with the administration, and are you also confident that this outlaws torture?

"Sen. McCAIN: That Detainee Treatment Act, they did have -- put that signing statement in, but it's -- they have never violated it to my knowledge, and we would challenge it if they did. And second of all, part of this agreement is adherence to the act that we passed, the Detainee Treatment Act. So, look, I believe the administration acted in good faith. We all understand the need to collect intelligence and we know how important it is. But we also ought to recognize that. . . .

"Mr. HARRIS: Do the tactics work? . . . Because the administration said these tactics work. Do they?

"Sen. McCAIN: I think that they work to an extent, but I also think that we have to be very careful, because we already have numerous examples where, if you torture somebody, they'll tell you anything that you want to know. Ask the British in Northern Ireland. Ask the French in Algeria. Ask the Israelis. So you've got to be very careful about the -- about these abuses.

"Mr. HARRIS: Well, you have access to more information about this than any of us because you've been in the negotiations.

"Sen. McCAIN: No, actually I. . . .

"Mr. HARRIS: You know of specific instances where these tactics have produced valuable information. And. . . .

"Sen. McCAIN: Only what the president talked about in his speech, and there has been, everyone agrees, there has been some valuable information gained. Exactly what techniques were used in obtaining that, I certainly don't know."

Perhaps it shouldn't come as a surprise how little McCain knows. Rick Klein writes in the Boston Globe: "As lawmakers prepare to debate the CIA's special interrogation program for terrorism suspects, fewer than 10 percent of the members of Congress have been told which interrogation techniques have been used in the past, and none of them know which ones would be permissible under proposed changes to the War Crimes Act. . . .

"The lack of consultation means that senators and representatives will be voting next week to authorize a program that most know little about, raising questions about Congress's oft-repeated vow to increase its oversight of the war on terrorism."