Howard Kurtz
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, June 20, 2005; 12:00 PM

Howard Kurtz has been The Washington Post's media reporter since 1990. He is also the host of CNN's "Reliable Sources" and the author of "Media Circus," "Hot Air," "Spin Cycle" and "The Fortune Tellers: Inside Wall Street's Game of Money, Media and Manipulation." Kurtz talks about the press and the stories of the day in "Media Backtalk."

Howard Kurtz was online Monday, June 20, at Noon ET to discuss the press and his latest columns.

Read today's media notes: Shepard Smith, An Anchor Who is Never Heavy.

A transcript follows.

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Rockville, Md.: I read your column on Shephard Smith today. It was pretty good, but one thing you forgot to mention was how drop dead good looking he is. I would never have guessed that he was 41, though. Doesn't look a day over 30. I love the show, but there are times when I wonder if he is hyperactive, the way it moves so fast. But he is very likable!

Howard Kurtz: Guess I missed that CRUCIAL DETAIL. Maybe I need glasses.

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Washington, D.C.: I have seen no press comment or follow up on Gov. Jeb Bush's order, following the announcement of the autopsy in the Schiavo case, of an investigation into Mr. Schiavo's conduct in the first half-hour, 15 years ago, following Mrs. Schiavo's collapse. As an act of pure spite it sheds light on the character of a person who is not only a Governor and the President's brother, but a person spoken of as a possible presidential candidate in 2008. Have I just missed the commentary?

Howard Kurtz: As best I can tell, this just happened over the weekend.

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Germantown, Md.: Howie-I know you addressed this briefly on your show with Peter Jennings comment about the Michael Jackson trial, but I am stilly mystified. How is it that smart, educated, seasoned news reporters are still covering these stories? For example, doesn't Katie Couric feel just SILLY interviewing a woman who just got paid $500,000 dollars because she CALLED OFF her wedding? And aren't reporters aware that they are only talking about young, white, woman that are missing? Please provide some insight into how a reporter justifies these stories to themselves?

P.S. Do you know what Bill Hemmer has decided to do?

Howard Kurtz: Well, apparently Katie Couric doesn't feel silly, since NBC is devoting a prime-time hour to her runaway bride interview tomorrow night. Look, I've said again and again that the media turn these missing-woman sagas into national psychodramas (Aruba has probably gotten more coverage in the past month than in the preceding 20 years), but that the Jennifer Wilbanks story was particularly egregious because it continued long after we knew that she had simply lied and skipped out on her wedding. Obviously people who make more money than I do concluded there was a public appetite for this.

P.S. - Bill Hemmer has left CNN. He said his goodbye on American Morning last week.

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Rutherfordton, N.C.: As a former Senate and White House staffer, (late 60's early 70's) I don't recall exchanges in the Senate and between Congress and the Presidency reaching this level of bickering. What's your take from a newsman's viewpoint?

Howard Kurtz: I don't agree. There were huge battles over subpoenas and other issues between the Reagan administration and Congress, and major executive-privilege fights between the Clinton administration and the Hill over various investigations of the White House.

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Wexford, Pa.: In the unbelievably over-saturated Natalee Holloway coverage, I've not seen a single reporter ask this question about the dozen FBI agents were down in Aruba helping investigators - does the FBI always send so many agents, if any, when any American goes missing anywhere in the world? Or, is this courtesy only extended to attractive, young white women who, as always is the case, garner all the attention of the U.S. media?

Howard Kurtz: I think your question answers itself. FBI officials watch television too, you know.

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Vienna, Va.: You should do a piece on Paula Zahn. Now SHE is drop-dead gorgeous! Do you know how old she is and her marital status?

Please look into this.

Howard Kurtz: Ms. Zahn is married and in her forties, so calm down.

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Reston, Va.: Mr. Kurtz,

I read your column today where you, like others at The Post (and the media in general) chastise the Democrats for "lacking a plan." I do not know why, in an off-year (i.e. non-election year) the Democrats must have a plan, while those in power have none. Could you elaborate on this--given that it is a constant theme in your writing and your colleagues' writing? The Democrats' plan is to bring the troops home as soon as possible--the Republicans' plan changes from day to day--5 to 10 more years of occupation, no, the troops will be home tomorrow--no, it will be at least three months, but wait, it will be necessary to stay for three more years.

Howard Kurtz: I didn't say anything about the Democrats lacking a plan. It must have been one of the articles I excerpted.

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Nashville, Tenn.: Mr. Kurtz, Do you confine your media notes column to strictly American journalism? I've noticed that you haven't subjected the Downing Street memos to the same critical analysis that you did the Rathergate memos. Originally they were posted in the Sunday Times of London. Now that they are appear on the L.A. Times web site, shouldn't you be speaking to the fact that as in Rathergate, these are not originals?

Howard Kurtz: I just found out that the memos as reported by the Sunday Times were not originals and dealt with that in this morning's column. But I'd be careful about the CBS/Rather comparisons.

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Washington, D.C.: Mr. Kurtz,

British reporter Michael Smith, who has been flogging for the impeachment of President Bush, informed the Associated Press over the weekend that the famous Downing Street Memos he's been reporting on are re-typed versions and that the originals were destroyed.

If only Dana Milbank had known that before he wrote his mocking column of the John Conyers hearing about the memos.

Once again we are left with the media using manufactured documents in a naked effort to drive President Bush from office.

Those, like Michael Smith, hoping for Bush's impeachment must surely know that these re-typed documents would not be admissible as evidence in any court.

Howard Kurtz: "Manufactured" documents? Seems to me you are leaping to a conclusion here.

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On The Beach: Howie... for a political junkie and news reporter like myself, the Sunday morning shows (your's included) are always of particular interest to me. But I'm wondering, for all the talk about how Meet the Press is the top rated show among that set, just how prolific are those shows to the general public?

For instance, while Meet the Press is the top-rated show, are its ratings only comparable to UPN's prime time lineup, or substantially better? And if the former is the case, is the importance of such shows overstated by those of us in the media? Just looking for your thoughts.

Howard Kurtz: I don't have the numbers at my fingertips, but Meet the Press draws a substantial audience, even though, like any news show, it's not in the CSI or Law and Order ballpark. But its influence and that of the other Sunday shows goes beyond the numbers of people who watch. Guests often make news on these programs that are picked up by the Monday morning papers, and because much of the political establishment watches, the shows influence the larger debate about politics and issues as well.

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Ellicott City, Md.: So Michael Jackson's trial is over. Will the media circus that surrounds him dwindle, or intensify?

Howard Kurtz: Given that there were 1,200-plus journalists camped out at the Santa Maria courthouse, I'd say the coverage is in the process of diminishing.

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Long Island, N.Y.: RE: the DSM ..."Of course, no British official has said they were fake."

Not to say that the memos do not accurately reflect what occurred, but isn't this the same type "non-denial" that got Newsweek into hot water with the Gitmo reports?

Howard Kurtz: It's not a non-denial. The Newsweek story was based on an unnamed source, with no documents. The Rather story was based on documents supposedly written by a guy who's been dead for two decades, the ultimate origin of which CBS did not know. The Downing Street memo involves minutes of a meeting with Tony Blair three years ago, attended by a number of high-level British officials, all of whom are still alive and none of whom has said the memo was fake. That seems to be to be a very different circumstance.

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Nashville, Tenn.: How do you respond to criticism that the reason The Post has pooh-poohed the Downing Street memos is that it doesn't want to be eclipsed on the Watergate story? Just today Mr. Dobbs writes in the Post, "But for a crucial year in his life and the country's life, he was at the vortex of the greatest political scandal in modern American history."

Howard Kurtz: The Post was clearly and undeniably slow on the Downing Street story but I see absolutely no connection to Watergate. The Deep Throat revelation (which, remember, was broken by Vanity Fair) was going to get a huge amount of coverage no matter what, and it broke a full month after the Sunday Times of London first reported on the British memo.

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Boston, Mass.: Has Jeb Bush lost his mind? His Captain Ahab-like obsession with the Schiavo saga is a little bizarre for a big-state governor and potential presidential candidate.

Howard Kurtz: I'll take the governor at his word that he feels strongly about the issue, but it did seem to me that the autopsy settled the major questions about the matter.

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Essington, Pa.: Howard, I watched the "new" American Morning show on CNN today. The graphic they put under Miles and Soledad O'Brien really made it look like they were married (even saying "Miles and Soledad O'Brien" makes it sound that way, too). You think this is something they did for convenience, or are they feigning anchor chemistry?

Howard Kurtz: Maybe they were just having a little fun.

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Knoxville, Tenn.: Amazing how not one of the weekend talk shows bothered to have Rep. John Conyers on after his meeting on DSM (Downing Street Memos)was one of the most talked about subjects in the country last week. The DSM meeting went on despite James Sensenbreener's best attempts to block them from even having access to a meeting room. Then the Republicans kept bringing up procedural votes one after another that afternoon so that the congressional members had to keep leaving and going to vote. Interesting how the Alphabets-the cable shows-and all the reporters on the individual shows refuse to bring it up.

Howard Kurtz: Meet the Press did bring it up last week, but I take your point.

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Re: Reston, Va.: Howie, you very disingenuously avoided answering Reston's question. Why is the media so preoccupied with the Democrats having no plan, instead of with the plans (or lack thereof) of the administration currently in charge?

Howard Kurtz: Yes, I DISINGENUOUSLY denied writing something I had never written. How fiendishly clever of me. Look, we've written and broadcast thousands of pieces about, for example, Bush's Social Security plan and the weaknesses thereof. It's certainly fair to ask whether the Democrats have an alternative in light of their strategy of refusing to negotiate until private accounts are off the table. Same goes for Iraq.

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Washington, D.C.: Howard -- what is the status of the Valerie Plame/Robert Novak leak investigation? Are Judith Miller and Matthew -forgot his last name-going to go to jail? Is Novak going to sit around and watch a couple of colleagues be imprisoned when it was HE and not they who published the leak? It is outrageous that the DOJ is going to put a couple of reporters in jail when it's a member of the administration who potentially committed a crime! This is the type of thing for which the U.S. criticizes governments of other countries... and we are doing it in our own back yard.

Also, why don't you do more reporting on this, Howard? Maybe in each online and print column do a little "Plame Update" blurb? Even if there is nothing new to report, you could keep the flame alive, so to speak. I am sure that as a journalist yourself you are outraged that this is happening.

Howard Kurtz: At the moment, Judith Miller and Matt Cooper are appealing their contempt citation to the Supreme Court, and will face jail terms if they lose or if the high court refuses to take the case. No one knows whether Novak has testified about his sources or not been asked to provide such testimony, since he refuses to say. My colleagues and I have covered every development in this case, but as in many legal battles, there are long stretches where nothing happens and there is not much new to report.

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Baltimore, Md.: Re: FBI agents in Aruba

I think you are a little off base regarding why so many FBI agents are involved in this instance. A main reason is that the country of Aruba permitted the agents into the country where in most instances elsewhere, the nation considers such American intrusion as a declaration of the nation's lack of capability in handling what it considers to be its own affairs.

Howard Kurtz: Yes, but FBI agents are generally allowed to investigate in America, where the vast majority of these media-saturated missing-woman cases have taken place.

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Cold Spring, N.Y.: Do me a favor sir? In light of the fact that "West Wing" has made it common knowledge to those of us who watch, would you please consider watching carefully what the White House "throws out with the trash" at the Friday press briefings? Since we now know that 'nobody' watches the news on Saturday, could you make a point of reminding us on, say, Monday, that someone like Mister 'manipulated scientific reports on global warming' American Petroleum Institute was forced to retire over the (last) weekend? Thanks!

Howard Kurtz: I did mention that in an earlier column. And yes, this White House, like the Clinton administration, does its share of Friday night specials.

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Re. Washington, D.C.: "British reporter Michael Smith, who has been flogging for the impeachment of President Bush, informed the Associated Press over the weekend that the famous Downing Street Memos he's been reporting on are re-typed versions and that the originals were destroyed."

Correct me if I'm wrong about this, Howard, but there hasn't been a single person in the Blair government who claims these memos or their contents are fabricated. In fact, government officials indicate the information is accurate, though, a la President Bush, they insist its old news and we "must move forward."

By the way, it's appalling that the U.S. media is more concerned about Natalee Holloway than possible government lies leading to a costly war. Just my opinion.

Howard Kurtz: While people can argue about the interpretation, I am not aware of a single British official who has said the memo involving that 2002 meeting with Blair are fake.

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Washington, D.C.: Howard -- All weekend the TV talk show hosts were quick to ask their pro-Administration guests whether Sen. Durbin should apologize for his remarks comparing the treatment of terror prisoners at Guantanamo to repressive regimes. And the GOP guests easily clobbered the softball questions. But not one TV host asked any of the GOP guests what they thought of the actual brutal treatment that Durbin is complaining about. That seems to me to be some poor journalism in getting caught up in the GOP attack on Durbin instead of zeroing in on the real story--what is happening with the detainees. What do you think of the TV media's performance on this?

Howard Kurtz: I would say there's a legitimate controversy over what Senator Durbin said, even though many people do not believe he was likening American soldiers to Nazis. The question of whether U.S. prison guards have engaged in torture or abusive conduct has certainly received a huge amount of media attention, beginning with the Abu Ghraib photos last year and continuing through Alberto Gonzalez's interpretation of "quaint" Geneva Convention rules, the recent Pentagon report on Koran abuse, and so on.

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Chicago, Ill.: Any thoughts on the upcoming Hillary book? Even the ORMAM (Organized Republican Media Attack Machine) seems to be staying away from it, Drudge excepted. Limbaugh made veiled references to Hillary's sexuality in mentioning the book last week, but is it possible that the right's pathological sick obsession with HRH has peaked?

Howard Kurtz: I will be extremely interested to see how the media handles the book, which is being released tomorrow, and whether author Edward Klein gets booked on major TV programs.

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Washington, D.C.: Howard,

What is up with the San Francisco Chronicle hiring Sean Penn to do reporting on the Iranian election? Is this just some sort of publicity stunt?

Howard Kurtz: More or less. This isn't the first time Penn has taken on a writing assignment for the Chronicle.

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Nashville, Tenn.: Did I detect a little sarcasm in your Shepard Smith story? You don't advocate 40 quick stories and Razz-ma-tazz over the story which broke over the weekend that to be a counterterrorism leader at the FBI you don't have to have a working knowledge of who the terrorist groups are, do you?

Howard Kurtz: I report and you decide.

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Brooklyn, N.Y.: I read 2-3 newspapers a day, couple of magazines, visit a number of political-info Web sites and receive articles and info from C-Span-span, radio, news shows, and friends. It can be a number of hours every day.

I have come to realize how much time and effort it takes to sift through all the media to get the "info" and draw my own conclusions. I can understand why so few people are really informed these days. If a person reads just one paper or watches one news show it is questionable how informed they really can be. I have spoken to intelligent, professional people that seem to be clueless about important issues like the Patriot Act, U.N., Bankruptcy law, Downing Street memos, etc. They pick up superficial glimpses here or there from one show or newspaper and go with the flow of their party without much question.

I keep wondering what could happen to change this? Everyone's life has more demands and decisions and responsibilities. What would inspire the public to take the time to stay informed when that time has to come from all the other commitments? Would it take something drastic like the draft or a terrorist tragedy?

How do media people view this as far as capturing people's attention to engage and inform them and inspire their involvement in "knowing"? Or is that just not the objective of news media and it is totally about selling the paper/show/position and spinning to build like constituencies?

Howard Kurtz: Look, people are free to consume as much media as they think they need. Some are happy just to read the local paper, others surf the Web, others rely on TV or radio. The most informed consumers obviously dip into multiple sources, but people outside the journo-political complex are busy with their jobs and families. There's so much out there these days that no one, including me, can absorb it all. One of the reasons I write the online column is to give folks a quick fix on what's being reported and argued over in the MSM and the blogosphere.

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Washington, D.C.: "Manufactured" documents? Seems to me you are leaping to a conclusion here.

Mr. Kurtz,

Yes, manufactured. Where are the original Bush National Guard documents? Where are the original Downing Street Memos?

Nowhere, mon frere. The burden is on the reporters to produce real evidence to back their stories. Especially when they are using their reporting to take down a president of the United States.

Howard Kurtz: You're entitled to your view. If there was a single British official who attended the meeting to which the Downing Street memo refers who stood up and said this never happened and this document is a fake, I would be more inclined to doubt the document's authenticity.

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Leesburg, Va.: There is a recent spate of stories in The Post obsessed with rehashing the distant past from a PC perspective--stories on slavery reparations, an anti-lynching resolution and Sen. Byrd's KKK past. Are liberal political groups behind these stories or is the primary push from the media? I think it is some of both. Liberal politicians know that liberal media outlets will gladly publish their viewpoints. And the latter are interested in rewriting history from a liberal-PC perspective. What do you think?

Howard Kurtz: Well, the apology for lynching was voted on by the United States Senate (which, the last time I checked, is controlled by Republicans) and the Byrd article in yesterday's Post grew out of the senator's newly published memoirs. So both of those seem to be a case of reacting to the news rather than pushing some kind of agenda.

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Brooklyn, N.Y.: Speaking of Judith Miller and Matt Cooper and the origin of their problems -- what is happening with the investigations into who revealed Valerie Plame? Is it totally dependent on them to find the person who gave her identity? I am shocked to think that the person who revealed her identity cannot be found without their testimony especially if Novak has sung. Even without the testimony of any of them, how many suspects could there be? Makes me wonder if this is all an effort to never reveal the person who committed the traitorous act of revealing Valerie Plame? I bet if someone from the White House dropped a bombshell like the Downing Street memo into the media they would be found quickly!

Howard Kurtz: The special prosecutor in the case is continuing his investigation, and it was his demand for testimony by Miller and Cooper that led to these contempt charges. As for whether the prosecutor will find out who outed Valerie Plame, I'll just say that the history of leak investigations is that they are usually unsuccessful.

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Southfield, Mich.: What's your take on The Post's only coverage on Rep. Conyers' hearing last week on the Downing Street Memo being Milbank's snarky column? (Not to mention it was only after the fact that we readers were informed, oh by the way, he's now an opinion columnist too.)

And I gotta say, I find the mainstream media's response to the memos' explosive content very amusing. It's as if British papers had discovered Watergate, covered the hell out of it, then the American papers sniffing months later that everybody knew about all that already (not that the info had ever been in the American papers' pages, natch).

Howard Kurtz: It would have been better if there was also a Post news story on the Conyers forum. It should be evident from the "Washington Sketch" logo on Milbank's column that he is not writing straight news stories, but perhaps his initial effort should have included some kind of editor's note making clear that this is news analysis.

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Washington, D.C.: In a previous response, you stated, "And yes, this White House, like the Clinton administration, does its share of Friday night specials."

I'm just wondering why you felt it was necessary to include the part about the Clinton administration. If it was to demonstrate that the current administration is not alone in this practice, I would think "like previous administrations" would have sufficed. Was the Friday night special created by the Clinton admin? Or did you mention it to fend off accusation of bias? Regardless, do you think journalists are becoming more and more likely to take such preemptive action?

Howard Kurtz: I covered the eight-year clash between the Clinton administration and the press, wrote a book about it in fact, and just think it's useful to occasionally remind people that not all the news management techniques we see these days were invented by George W. Bush.

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Excelsior Springs, Mo.: Why didn't The Washington Post print John Conyers rebuttal to Dana Milbank's column? I was on of over a half million people to sign the petition and the hearings were virtually ignored. I think this is a legitimate question, but mine never seem to get answered.

Howard Kurtz: I did quote from a John Conyers post on the Huffington blog about media coverage of the Downing Street memo in a story I wrote last week about why the press was slow to cover the memo and how liberal activists and some Democrats have been successful in pressing journalists to take another look.

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Savannah, Ga.: Howie,

To follow up from before, saying the memos are not fake is NOT the same thing as saying that the most damaging line in the memo is (not?).

I have no doubts that the meetings occurred, and I do differ in the interpretation of "fixed," because Websters has seven different definitions, two of which could apply here.

What we have in this memo is one man's, albeit a very senior man's, opinion. He thinks the policy was "fixed." OK, so what? Other people disagree. No one has ever came out and said a, that the line was in the original and b, what they meant by "fixed" if it was.

Howard Kurtz: I agree that the memo is one man's opinion, but he is attempting to reflect the views of the British Cabinet at that meeting. The memo doesn't "prove" the intelligence was fixed--indeed, it includes no specifics along those lines--but does give us insight into the views at that time of America's strongest ally in the Iraq war.

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Re: DSM docs, apologies for lynchings: Looks like some questioners have been reading their right-wing blogger talking points memos. I find it incredibly ironic that some of these people are so concerned about whether the documents are originals when original documentation seemed to matter little to them when it involved John Kerry's Purple Hearts.

As for lynchings and slavery being a part of the "distant past," some of the people who participated in and suffered the impact of lynchings are still very much alive. And we will never get past the legacy of slavery if we don't first seriously acknowledge how our present was built upon that past. Kudos to the media for paying attention to the story, instead of having their heads up their you-know-whats, which some seem to prefer.

P.S. Sen. Byrd is a Democrat. If the liberal media were out to push liberal agendas in favor of liberal politicians, would they not ignore his past?

Howard Kurtz: Well, I don't think we can ignore Byrd's past role in the Klan, which I didn't realize lasted as long as it did until reading Eric Pianin's piece in The Post yesterday. But journalists certainly can't ignore it when the West Virginian publishes a book about his life.

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Phillipstown, N.Y.: I'm sure I'm not alone in this: when discussing issues with those of opposing viewpoints, I am constantly confronted with comments like, "ah, well that media source (NY Times, Post publications, et al) is controlled by the liberals." These comments are considered adequate to completely dismiss the source as hopelessly biased and thus, unreliable.

What would YOU consider a good response designed to disarm such dismissals?

Howard Kurtz: The liberals are too disorganized to "control" anything.

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San Anselmo, Calif.: You are a perfect example of how out of touch the elite media is with our elite celebrities. On your show, you made fun of Michael Jackson's umbrella since it wasn't raining. I'll admit that the umbrella is strange, but a lot of people use umbrella's to shield from the sun.

Howard Kurtz: Yes, but a lot of people don't bleach their skin white, climb on top of an SUV when coming to court on child molestation charges, acknowledge sleeping with young boys and have an AIDE carry an umbrella over them on the sunniest of sunny days. The media were too quick to convict Michael Jackson, as I noted on the show, but that doesn't mean he isn't a world-class oddball.

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College Park, Md.: It's nice to hear that my brother is a Nazi, a Gulag torturer, etc. etc. simply for guarding prisoners in the new death camp of our times. Wait, I guess a death camp has to actually have deaths associated with it.

Why is The Post ignoring Durbin's comments? At least when Amnesty declared the camp a "gulag" The Post covered it front and center. Is it just not big news anymore that Democrats are willing to overblow anything the President does?

Howard Kurtz: Friday: Durbin Defends Guantanamo Comments

Sunday: Frist Insists on Apology for Durbin's Remarks

Guess we're not doing a very good job of ignoring the story.

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re: Too Much Media: Howard-

In response to the person who mentioned that it's difficult for your average media consumer to have all the information, I'd like to thank you for helping with that task. I know your column is usually written as information/critique/praise of various media outlets and media in general, but the one of the side-benefits of that is that by 9 a.m. each morning, I've got a pretty good grasp of what is happening around the world and the differing flavors of the coverage. Thanks!

Howard Kurtz: Well, I appreciate that, especially since I'm often bleary-eyed from trying to file early each morning.

Thanks for the chat, folks.

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