Critiquing the Press

Howard Kurtz has been The Washington Post's media reporter since 1990. He is also the host of CNN's "Reliable Sources" and the author of "Media Circus," "Hot Air," "Spin Cycle" and "The Fortune Tellers: Inside Wall Street's Game of Money, Media and Manipulation." Kurtz talks about the press and the stories of the day in "Media Backtalk."

Howard Kurtz was online Monday, Jan. 9, at noon ET to discuss the press and his latest columns.

Was the Media's Credibility Buried? , ( Post, Jan. 9, 2006 )

The transcript follows.

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Arlington, Va.: Isn't the media's rush to report unfounded rumor in the mine disaster just an especially acute repeat of what happened under Katrina? At the time of the hurricane, the press reported all sorts of unconfirmed rumors that have since been discredited: There weren't 25,000 dead, and there weren't rape gangs in the Superdome. The dead were not disproportionately poor or minority. People weren't really shooting at helicopters. Aaron Broussard's story of an old woman dying while awaiting rescue turned out to have happened before the hurricane, not after.

Isn't the erroneous story of mining survivors just more of the same?

Howard Kurtz: Yes, it very much reminds me of Katrina, which is why I made the comparison in today's column. Journalists ran with stories about rapes and murders in the Superdome because they were quoting officials who didn't know what they were talking about. The hurricane, like the mining disaster, produced a chaotic situation with all kinds of rumors and misinformation floating around. On the Broussard story, though, he gave that account on Meet the Press -- Tim Russert obviously had no way of knowing the details, and had Broussard back to discuss the misrepresentations.

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Yardley, Pa.: Howard,

I cringed yesterday when I heard, I think Joe Johns say that hearing a Congressman confirm the information that the miners were alive was good enough for him! Unbelievable! What every happened to primary sources and true investigative reporting??? Was anybody asking, or trying to find out from those in a position to know how they knew for a fact the miners were alive, had they actually talked to any of them, seen them, etc., what shape they were in. I mean, North Korean TV could have done what these guys did!

Howard Kurtz: CNN's Joe Johns indeed made the comment on Reliable Sources, and I can see where reporters on deadline might say to themselves, well, if Rep. Shelly Moore Capito says the miners are alive, it must be true. What the reporters did not do, apparently, is say, "Congresswoman, how do you know this? What first-hand knowledge do you have?" Elected officials can make the same mistakes as journalists in time of crisis.

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Arlington, Va.: I'm a bit confused as to why you're reporting on mine safety statistics in a column about the press, but shouldn't you also point out the statistics that make the opposite case? Under the current administration, mining deaths have continued their long decrease. The mining injury rate has dropped since 2000. Criminal prosecutions may be down, but safety citations have risen since 2000.

Moreover, who is to say what it means that criminal prosecutions are down: is that because of less enforcement or less criminality? Put another way, if criminal prosecutions had gone up in the past five years, isn't it likely that the press would be equally critical of authorities for allowing a crime wave to flourish?

Howard Kurtz: My point was there had been almost no examination of the mine safety agency's record, good and bad, by the major media. I focused on enforcement because of the now-widely reported fact that the Sago mine had been cited for 273 violations but received no substantial penalties. The Post had a piece yesterday examining the matter, which noted the decline in the number of deaths as well as the shift in enforcement strategy from the Clinton years. I continue to wonder why a mine safety agency official wasn't made available for yesterday's Post article, rather than having the agency hide behind a prepared statement.

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Annandale, Va.: Howard--What's with this new Washington Post radio project? As I understand it, a new station will be broadcasting on 1500 AM using content developed by The Post. Have any background on this?

Howard Kurtz: I don't think anyone has quite figured out how Washington Post Radio will work. But the executives involved were quoted by the paper last week as saying that "the stations will be the 'long-form' version of WTOP's shorter news reports, with interviews, commentary and news provided by The Post's journalists."

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Fairfax, Va.: Why does The Post allot so much space and headlines to the personal biography of Judge Alito and relatively little ink to the impact his decisions have had socially and economically on say, corporate interests versus worker's interests? After all, Supreme Court justices have a tremendous impact on numerous areas of our country's political and economic life.

Howard Kurtz: I think that's a bum rap. The Post has published many, many articles about Alito's rulings, past writings as a Reagan administration official, judicial philosophy and so on--probably more than most readers have an appetite to digest. The two-part profile that ended today was designed to be a look at who this man is and the forces that shaped him.

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Arlington, Va.: I agree with Jon Stewart...why can't The Media leave people alone in their time of grief and tragedy? Why are the family members of victims of all sorts of tragedy interviewed? Why do we need to know how they "feel"? And is it really national news when some poor guy painting the inside of a water tower falls down and gets hurt? Or is it just news because CNN has access to a helicopter hovering overhead which can't even really see anything because the guy is INSIDE the water tower?

Howard Kurtz: I've been in that situation a number of times in my career. I've always treaded very carefully, and I believe most (but hardly all) journalists do as well. What I've found is that some people definitely don't want to talk, and after a polite inquiry I apologize for bothering them at a difficult time. But many people do want to talk -- either to vent their grief or to ensure, in some small way, that their loved one is remembered.

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New York, N.Y.: Howard,

Regarding the media coverage of the Sago mine disaster:

In the future, do you think the media will be overly meticulous in confirming all aspects of what they are reporting, will they get it "just right," or will the pressure to be first to break the story trump any circumspection resulting from this tragedy?

Howard Kurtz: Since most journalists are saying they did nothing wrong, I can only assume that they would do the same thing in a similar situation in the future. What, exactly, would be wrong with saying: "We're hearing conflicting reports, but the facts are unclear and nothing has been confirmed"?

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New York, N.Y.: "There are no Democrats who took money from Jack Abramoff, not one, not one single Democrat. Every person named in this scandal is a Republican. Every person under investigation is a Republican. Every person indicted is a Republican. This is a Republican finance scandal. There is no evidence that Jack Abramoff ever gave any Democrat any money. And we've looked through all of those FEC reports to make sure that's true."

This is what Howard Dean told your CNN colleague Wolf Blitzer this weekend (according to the CNN transcript). If what Dean says is true, why are the media insisting, along with the RNC, that this is an equal opportunity scandal?

Howard Kurtz: I don't believe the media are saying this is an equal opportunity scandal. It is a scandal about a Republican lobbyist and fundraiser and friend of Tom DeLay, that has already implicated another GOP congressman (Bob Ney), and most of those who are nervous are Republicans. The coverage, in my view, has fairly reflected that. However, it's also true that Abramoff, in the process of ripping off his clients, steered contributions to some Democrats as well as Republicans, and some of these Dems have since returned the money or donated it to charity.

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Seven Corners, Va.: Mr. Kurtz, thank you very much for noting that at times, our national media can be very slow to admit error, or very quick to deflect it onto bad sources of information. (Like say, believing Iraq had WMD?) Do you think anyone's giggling at the White House watching all these media outlets who demand Bush to admit his mistakes not living up to that in their own professional lives?

Howard Kurtz: Given the sadness of the subject, it's probably no laughing matter, but I'm sure the deflection of blame hasn't gone unnoticed. When Howell Raines had to resign from the NYT over the Jayson Blair debacle, some former Clinton officials, who resented the harsh criticism by Raines's editorial page when they were in the White House, were downright happy.

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Emmitsburg, Md.: Not to take away from the Republican failings in the Abramoff scandal, but this would seem to be the perfect opportunity for a multipart series of articles on how the lobbying, donation, influence peddling thing really works on the Hill. Instead we just have gotcha journalism and partisan snipping. It reminds me when we had lots of articles on Cheney's energy task force and how industry was writing legislation, but based on my experience over half of all non appropriation bills introduced by members of Congress are written by industry or special interests. Exposing the standard process would do more to clean up the system then pointing out the extremes.

Howard Kurtz: An excellent idea. The Post, I should note, has led the pack in reporting on Abramoff's illegal conduct. But a much broader piece (or pieces) is needed. I sometimes wonder whether Washington reporters get too inured to a system in which lobbyists can send lawmakers on golfing trips to Scotland or arrange basketball skyboxes for their fundraisers -- often winning legislative favors for clients in the process -- and it's all perfectly legal.

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Washington, D.C.: Post Radio: I heard an ad on WTOP characterizing it as "WTOP will interview Washington Post reporters." As opposed to just reading the morning Post all day?

I'm getting tired of reporters talking to other reporters (your column exempted b/c that's part of the point). It's gotten out of control on NPR since the dumping of Bob Edwards. On Morning Edition a few months ago, Renee introduced Steve who was interviewing a NYT reporter in Baghdad. If he had a story to report, then just report it! And NPR has its own correspondents in Baghdad. They're not good enough?

Sad. And I can't hear WGMS very well anymore.

Howard Kurtz: Well, why don't we wait until it's actually on the air until we slam it. Since The Post is a full business partner in this new station, it makes sense that its reporters and columnists would contribute to the programming.

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Bethesda, Md.: Regarding reporting on and speaking with those affected by the tragedy.

It seems to me that if reporters don't even try to get these stories, they would likely be accused of not caring and not being there when this awful thing happened. What's the line between interfering and ignoring what is obviously newsworthy, though tragic for some?

Howard Kurtz: You have to go there and pursue the story, and part of the story is the impact on the townspeople and family members. The problem is that given the gargantuan size of today's media, this can feel like an invasion to folks who live in the affected place, especially if it's a small town.

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Fairfax Station, Va.: Why isn't Howard Stern's new radio show under the rules of the FCC?

Howard Kurtz: The Federal Communications Commission has no jurisdiction over satellite radio because people pay for it and it's not part of the limited airwaves spectrum that is licensed by the government in the public interest. So Stern can say whatever the #@**&! he wants. In his debut this morning, there were barely any forbidden words, although there was some raunchy content.

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Re: Fairfax: I don't know about the Alito press, but I think this is a major problem of the press in general. Events and situations tend to be reported in the context of political fallout or gains, rather than how they will actually affect people's lives.

I've seen scads of reporting on how the conduct of the Iraq war is affecting Bush's "political capital," but few to none about how the Iraq war has cost the government so much that nearly every federal agency has been left in a funding crunch.

I've seen the articles about how Delay's issues are affecting the perception of the GOP, but how about some articles on how corruption at the highest levels of government, and all the ensuing time parsing their stance, picking a new leader, and defending oneself in court actually affects American GOVERNANCE?

I suppose culling projections and analyses from anonymous talking heads is easier, but I personally would prefer the longer, more tangible, more real-world view.

Howard Kurtz: That's a fair point. The press does sometimes have a scorecard mentality.

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Herndon, Va.: If The Post's editor truly thinks that "the media's performance here was fine under the circumstances" you are in worse shape than I thought. Can he not see the lack of reporting and fact checking by his and other reporters contributed to the publishing of an inaccurate and unsourced story? The lack of attribution in the story makes the facts written in The Post the responsibility of the paper; his failure to understand and acknowledge this makes the damage to The Post's reputation only worse.

Howard Kurtz: In my view, it might have been better if the paper had run an editor's note, or something like that, to explain how the erroneous front-page story came to be published. USA Today ran such a note and apologized to its readers. You can argue whether such an apology is necessary, but addressing the issue the next day seems like a good way to deal with readers' concerns.

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Bristow, Va.: I'm a little confused on your article today. First, you underline how Mr. Amoss have forfeited neutrality and advocated for the City of New Orleans. then you write: "Whether the Newhouse paper can thrive in a shrunken city is very much an open question. So is whether Amoss and his staff have forfeited their neutrality in their zeal to help the region." Didn't you already establish that Amoss's activism was not an "open question"?

Howard Kurtz: Jim Amoss, as editor of the New Orleans paper, has chosen to take an activist role on federal aid to the city -- so he probably has forfeited his neutrality -- but that doesn't necessarily apply to all the editors and reporters who work for him.

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Oklahoma City, Okla.: On Friday The Post had three major stories,penned by four reporters, on Abramoff. Meanwhile, Hillary Clinton's campaign committee was fined for some fairly blatant fund raising violations -- and The Post carried only the AP story, tucked away inside. A proportion problem, perhaps?

Howard Kurtz: It didn't bother me. The fundraising group for Hillary agreed to a $35,000 fine for underreporting hundreds of thousands of dollars spent on a Hollywood fundraiser in 2000. You don't get a medal for that, but it's a fairly common fundraising violation that was the subject of past articles in the paper. The FEC says her campaign didn't violate the law, unlike Abramoff, who admits he had taken kickbacks and was trying to bribe members of Congress. The Hollywood fundraiser involved in Clinton's case was tried for lying to the FEC, but he was acquitted.

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Washington, D.C.: This is a pretty small issue, and I'm young and pretty liberal, but is it too much to ask reporters in the field to wear a tie, or at least a decent coat, when doing a national news segment? I guess I understand casual dress in a place like post-Katrina New Orleans or post-tsunami Indonesia, but what was that NBC correspondent doing broadcasting from West Virginia in a bright yellow and black Columbia jacket? Is West Virginia too "gritty" to put on a trench coat and scarf? I know it's cold, but where is the professionalism? I know this is a small issue, but yeesh--you're on national TV. Comb your hair at least.

Howard Kurtz: I agree with the hair-combing part. But I'm afraid I don't agree that reporters in the field -- if they're at a coal mine or some other disaster scene -- have to wear a corporate uniform.

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Post Radio Idea: Maybe you'll be able to rebroadcast "Reliable Sources" on the radio later in the day? (I wish CNN would do that, since you're on at the same time as Russert and Schieffer.)

Howard Kurtz: What, you don't own a VCR? Yes, it's a competitive time period (although our first half hour, in D.C., is before Meet the Press or Face the Nation comes on).

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re: Washington Post Radio: I'd like to hear some sort of version of washingtonpost.com's Live Online. Maybe a schedule of the day's programming could be posted on the Internet, and listeners/readers/chatters could e-mail in comments before or during the show for comments.

I don't know if it would work, but it would be more productive (popular?) than call-in shows, or some sort of scaled back version of NPR, that's for sure.

Howard Kurtz: Not sure why it'd be more productive than a call-in show, since it eliminates the interaction between host and caller, but e-mail could certainly be an element. Cable TV tends to use e-mails more than radio.

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Re: Interviewing Grief-Stricken People: While I do think it is ghoulish the way the media seem to pounce on these people, THEY CAN ALWAYS DECLINE TO BE INTERVIEWED. I am constantly amazed that people allow themselves to be televised under such trying circumstances.

Howard Kurtz: Well, as I said, some want to be, some definitely do not. You usually don't see, or read about, all the people who decline.

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Dulles, Va.: Regarding last week's comments on journalists being overpaid: I think that in my cases, especially in specialties like business reporting, journalists are way underpaid relative to the market.

I know a number of highly talented people who left journalism because they could get 50-100% more than jobs at even top tier papers like The Post.

These were people who knew the ins-and-outs of statistics and the markets.

Howard Kurtz: I have no doubt that most of the people who work here could make significantly more in public relations or other fields. But there is something about journalism that drew them to the business, with full knowledge that it was not the highest-paying career option.

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Washington, D.C.: Howard Stern built his show on two things: a very big audience where he would say ever more shocking things to anger the public authorities. Today he has neither the audience nor the authorities to rebel against. He's has lost everything that made his style of humor so interesting.

Howard Kurtz: Well, since he debuted on satellite five hours ago, isn't it a little premature to make that judgment? Sirius now has 3.3 million subscribers, compared to under 1 million when Stern's deal was announced. Certainly he will ultimately be reaching a smaller audience than on free radio, but he told me, and other interviewers, that the creative freedom was more important to him (not to mention the truckload of money that Sirius has dumped on him).

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Re: Oklahoma City, Okla.: I think OK City was trying to say that instead of having four reporters write three overlapping stories on the same subject, perhaps one could have written about the Clinton fundraising fine - not all of us readers have the background information you provided burned into our memories. the lobbyist story is big, but when you overkill it you tend to miss other important stories.

Howard Kurtz: Fair enough. But as overkill-type stories go, I think Abramoff is a worthy subject. In fact, he's on the cover of the new Time magazine: "The Man Who Bought Washington."

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McLean, Va.: Howard, how big of an influence on the story does the media pack-mentality effect the news that is reported? For instance, with the mining story--it would seem that because of the race to get the story first, reporters and media organizations aren't researching as thoroughly. And once one media organization goes with a story, the pressure is immense on the others to jump out there with the same information so they don't look like they are too slow. How can the news media solve this problem, or can they?

Howard Kurtz: I don't think in this case it's only the race to be first, but the race to avoid being last. In other words, CNN or Fox has to wonder if they can be reporting "fate unknown" while MSNBC is declaring the miners alive, or vice versa. In the case of East Coast newspapers, they weren't beating anyone -- they wouldn't hit front porches and newsstands for an hour -- but were facing their final deadlines around midnight and had to discern the situation as best they could.

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Norwich, Conn.: Howard: As a law student and avid court-watcher, I have failed to glean any useful information from The Post's extensive series of articles on Alito's background, especially those that reach back into his college days. We all know that such historical trivia invites exaggerated speculation and is rarely predictive of any specific case. Why not instead have legal reporters focus their energies on the Court itself, the state of its jurisprudence at the close of the Rehnquist era, and what the addition of Roberts and Alito may do to the status quo?

Howard Kurtz: But as I noted earlier, we have done exactly that. I've lost count of how many stories the paper has published on Alito's jurisprudence. Since he would be one of nine Supreme Court justices, and since most Americans had never heard of him before, isn't there a place for stories that tell us who this man is? And wouldn't his upbringing and life experience likely have some impact on his role as a judge?

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Kettering, Ohio: I have a layperson's question about editorials.

Is there a sliding standard for an editorial page regarding advocacy and outright huckstering. I have no problem with the New Orleans editor advocating for his hometown. On the other hand, I think some papers have contributed to a growing awareness that some papers and other media have an agenda that is political rather than civic. Dan Rather clearly had an agenda that ultimately led him across a line of credibility which made continuing as a commentator impossible, even in a newsroom like that of CBS. I would guess there is a scale, somewhat like that for porn, that makes some advocacy fine, and indeed expected. While there may be another line where credibility trumps advocacy.

Thanks for your time and consideration!

Howard Kurtz: Newspaper editorial pages are allowed to have an agenda -- political, cultural or otherwise -- because it's the one place in the paper where you're supposed to get unvarnished opinion. In the case of Jim Amoss at the Times Picayune, he not only oversees the editorial page but the news coverage as well as the paper's top editor. As for Rather, he stepped down in the midst of an investigation in which he and CBS News made serious mistakes, but it was not an investigation of his political leanings.

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Washington, D.C.: Stern has done well for himself since the day I first heard him on DC101 in 1980. He called City Hall on his first day to ask the Mayor if he would hold a parade to greet him, and Stern almost exploded when he learned that the Mayor was a man whose first name was Marion.

Howard Kurtz: And that was years BEFORE Marion Barry's crack arrest.

Thanks for the chat, folks.

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