Chertoff Announces Changes to FEMA Structure

Says Response to Natural Disasters Like Katrina A Priority

Washington Post staff writer Spencer Hsu was online Tuesday, Feb. 14, at 2 p.m. ET to discuss Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff 's announcement of changes in FEMA's structure aimed at improving response to natural disasters like Hurricane Katrina. Chertoff was responding in part to testimony by former FEMA director Michael Brown , who suggested that federal government response might have been quicker and more effective had the crisis been caused by a terrorist attack. Chertoff announced that the agency will be taking a "hard, honest look" at what it needs to do to be prepared for the next hurricane season.

The transcript follows.

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Spencer Hsu: Hello everybody,

Thanks for joining in today. Please forgive any technical glitches as I'm just getting acquainted with the format. We've got a lot of questions so I'll try get through as many as I can over the next 20-25 minutes or so.

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New York, N.Y. Hi-

How much of FEMA's budget has been slashed under Bush? Isn't that a major problem to begin with? Also, why won't Chertoff resign as he clearly failed to learn anything from 9/11.

Thanks!

Spencer Hsu: This is the concern raised by former FEMA director Michael Brown. Whatever the credibility of his performance in Katrina, as the agency's director he was familiar with his budgets and saw himself at least as an advocate.

His point was that the agency was losing out in competition with other agencies in the new Department of Homeland Security that it became a part of after 2003, and that the result reduced the agency's preparedness. He claimed that in 04 and 05, DHS levied about five 'assessments' a year totaling nearly $80 million, and that out of 3000 employees, in 05 it had to freeze 500 job slots.

Democrats say President Bush proposed $33 million less in FY 06 than what FEMA received in 2003.

On the other hand, Congress has appropriated more for umbrella missions of preparedness, response and recovery than the White House has asked for in 04 and 05.

And DHS Secretary Michael Chertoff has responded that funding for FEMA's core functions has increased between 2001 and 2005.

The bottom line is that there's a lot one can do with statistics, but plainly this was an area of conflict.

It's probably too sweeping to say that Secretary Chertoff didn't learn anything from 9/11. The administration has certainly done a great deal on homeland security. It's also important to point out that Chertoff was only in the job six months when Katrina hit, and was not responsible for things like, in fact, budgets before this year.

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Cambridge, Mass.: Hello Spencer, Thank you for the opportunity to write a question and comment. It has always puzzled me that the federal government does not place qualified engineers from its ranks in-charge of massive reconstruction projects like the Katrina reconstruction requires. Why not select and approve a qualified Air Force Engineer to run FEMA? Why an Air Force Engineer? Air Force engineers are trained to take care of the maintenance and construction and the base populous at Air Force bases around the world. We are trained in emergency services and emergency and consequence management since we put on the uniform. We are incident commanders. We constantly train to hone our skills. Our mission is to go into a war zone and build entire bases for 3,000 to 5,000 troops to conduct flying operations within 15-20 DAYS!!! We are construction managers, contracting officers, and we are planners extraordinaire! But first and foremost Air Force Engineers are dynamic and successful leaders! Our retired officers and top enlisted personnel fill the ranks of most of the top 100 engineering firms in the world today.

So why does this administration and DHS look to place people without these qualifications in charge of FEMA? If I had 400 engineers under my command we could house thousands of New Orleans evacuees in homes in 3-6 months. If I had a workforce of 1,500 people as Secretary Chertoff is recommending we would never had the debacle we have today in the post-Katrina era. FEMA and many of its key positions should be experienced engineers. We could help the President, DHS, the Gulf Coast victims, and this country.

Spencer Hsu: You're right. The issue of qualifications was a big part of Michael Brown's undoing, and the White House's decision to drop him.

Some Senate Democrats say there should be professional requirements for FEMA appointees subject to confirmation.

The pending House Katrina investigation report is set to recommend the president name a senior professional disaster advisor, akin to his military advisor, the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

A big point of discussion is what role the military in particular should play in homeland security. The military has the resources, but also the operational capacity and training to deploy very rapidly onto the ground in chaotic situations, something civilian agencies realize they lack. Expect to hear more about that in coming days, as well as the proper role of FEMA.

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Tulsa, Okla.: Do you think Chertoff will resign? Have confidence of the White House?

Spencer Hsu: White House spokesman Scott McClellan was just asked this, and per the Associated Press, had this to say.

"Secretary Chertoff is doing a great job," White House press secretary Scott McClellan said, answering a reporter's question about Chertoff. "The president appreciates his strong leadership. He is someone who is committed to doing everything he can to protect the American people and to continuing to take steps to make sure we are better prepared to respond to the threats that we face."

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The Estates of Riverdale Parke, Md.: Hi Spencer,

Critics of the government's response to Katrina pointed to the FEMA director's lack of relevant experience.

But what about the DHS boss? Does he have any experience running a large organization? If not, is it any wonder that he's ineffective?

Spencer Hsu: Mike Chertoff has an extremely impressive resume as a prosecutor, judge and senior Justice Department official overseeing the criminal division through the 9/11 attacks, a large and complicated organization.

There has been an undercurrent of concern within DHS among some quarters that much of the current leadership has a shared background as lawyers. The thinking is, that has led to a focus on process vs. operations. Tom Ridge, for all the challenges he faced starting up the department, was a former House member and governor who was perhaps focused on politics, but also the bottom line.

I think Secretary Chertoff had a difficult time as did many officials with the emergency lf Katrina, but many constituents say he is diligently and intelligently working through DHS's day to day problems.

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Harrisburg, Pa.: Isn't this a sign the government bureaucracy has become too top heavy in its management style? Shouldn't there be some preliminary agreements that decisions such as: respond to an emergency by sending in (whatever is needed: helicopters, supplies, food, etc.) may proceed without prior approval from higher-ups in management? Would you agree we need to reevaluate how to incorporate greater flexibility in responses during emergencies?

Spencer Hsu: These seem like reasonable questions and seem to be the direction FEMA and DHS are moving in.

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Harrisburg, Pa.: I read Ms. Townsend's speech from the NEMA conference yesterday and did not see much in regards to FEMA. Do you see the report the White House is putting out being much different from the House report? The White House seems to be more comprehensive and has more recommendations, what are your thoughts?

Spencer Hsu: It's a little early to say. For one thing, the White House review that Homeland Security Advisor Frances Fragos Townsend is leading is intended to be government wide, focusing on inter-departmental issues, such as interaction with the Pentagon, the Health and Human Services Department and so on. So by definition, while the review is concerned with FEMA, it's not exclusively so. In fact, FEMA is the direct responsibility of DHS and its secretary, who would want to exercise authority over a component agency.

The White House report is being billed as more comprehensive, and certainly would have the benefit of full cooperation, access to administration officials and perhaps, a little more time. Time will tell.

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North Tonawanda, N.Y.: When do you anticipate the additional 1500 full-time FEMA employees being hired?

Spencer Hsu: The proposed FY07 budget includes more than $300 million more for FEMA, but does not take effect until the fiscal year starting Oct. 1. Presumably that will pave the way for hires.

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Fairfax, Va.: Sec. Chertoff's ideas to change FEMA seem way too lofty. Hurricane season starts in a couple of months and says he is going to revamp the FEMA IT structure? Why does he not identify quick fixes? What do you think, based on the House report and the ideas that Fran Townsend put out yesterday, would be some of the easier fixes?

Spencer Hsu: The June 1 hurricane season opening is both a practical and political hurdle that the administration is very much focused on, in this congressional election year.

I think there's a combination of things going on. Big fixes, such as with data integration, budgets and personnel take more than a couple of months to fix.

But the department is trying to do many things in a hurry, such as requiring coastal states to exercise evacuation plans, improve and toughen contracting requirements for logistical services to give the department more "visibility" of and control over deliveries, and require states and the 75 largest urban areas to review their own plans.

That last review was pledged by President Bush in his New Orleans speech after the hurricane. His budget proposes $50 million to implement changes. But again, that won't take effect, if it takes effect, until fall.

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Camarillo, Calif.: FEMA was designed to supplement, not supplant local response capability. A lot of criticism has been aimed at FEMA that ought to have been aimed at local, county-parish and state agencies for their failure to prepare adequately or at all. The fact that agencies in New Orleans and Louisiana had never been provided with swiftwater and flood rescue training and equipment is one clear example. How can you rescue people from floodwater unless you have the right training and equipment? For the first time ever, FEMA called up eight swiftwater and flood rescue strike teams from California, and they ought to be given credit for doing this. But much more needs to be done to prepare agencies at ALL levels to manage flood rescue missions. Neither the Coast Guard nor US military are trained in swiftwater and flood rescue, nor are the 28 FEMA urban search and rescue teams.

Spencer Hsu: You hit a nail on the head here. FEMA is not a fire department, not the National Guard. Local and state governments were responsible for a lot of things, and failed in many ways in Katrina.

The question these Washington reviews are looking at is, in cases of large catastrophes when even well-prepared locals and states would be overwhelmed, how capable and how assertive should the federal government be.

Who should handle such complex, resource intensive missions. The military? And how can you coordinate such aggressive emergency response in a way that mayors and governors will be ok with that.

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Tulsa, Okla.: What are the chances that Congress will take FEMA out of Homeland Security? Needs to happen! The media want to focus on individuals (Brown, Chertoff, etc.), but part of the problem is structural. Thanks!

Spencer Hsu: I don't hear much enthusiasm for a re-re-reorganization, but there is understanding that the issues are structural. This issue is being worked through, I suspect, with a goal of doing as much as possible with minimal disruption.

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Rockville, Md.: With his new mustache is Chertoff going for the John Waters look?

Spencer Hsu: Couple last questions.

I don't have an answer to this one, but it's a question making a lot of rounds.

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Fairfax Station, Va.: Does anyone really believe that this administration has the will and/or ability to govern? Katrina, like everything else to the Bush administration is just a PR issue.

My question; Can disaster response be outsourced to private industry. Private industry has the best logistics due to the advances in inventory management. Why can't the U.S. pay a license fee to Ryder, Wal Mart, Etc. for readiness and then a cost plus configuration for actual disaster recovery? These companies have the products and logistics to respond to an emergency.

Spencer Hsu: I've heard from a few questioners who ask variations of this. Can more of disaster response be privatized? Is the administration committed to the emergency role of government.

Katrina covered 3 times as much ground as the Great Mississippi flood of 1927, created 6 times as much debris as Hurricane Andrew in south Florida in 1992, and displaced 90 percent of 2.3 million people who were evacuated, Chertoff pointed out yesterday. It was enormous, and the problems to be worked through are great.

The administration seems to be committed to its review, what will remain to be seen is if everyone, the White House, Congress, governors, mayors, the private sector and the public remain engaged in the recommendations and the outcomes.

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Spencer Hsu: Thanks everyone for joining, sorry we couldn't get to everyone's questions, your interest is very much valued and appreciated.

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