Immigration Debate

Washington Post staff writer S. Mitra Kalita was online to discuss immigrants who are calling for tighter U.S. borders. She writes that the issue complicates a debate often framed in racial terms, with immigrants on one side and native-born, white Americans on the other.

Read more in her story, Dissonant Voices Inside the Border .

A transcript follows. .

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S. Mitra Kalita: Hi, everyone. Thanks for joining me today. I have already gotten some e-mails and voicemails on today's story so I welcome the chance to dissect some of these issues with you ovee the next hour or so. Please do try to be respectful and brief in your submissions so I can get to as many questions and comments as possible... As always, do stay in touch beyond this virtual chat and drop me story ideas, observations and thoughts at kalitam@washpost.com. Thanks for playing and let's begin...

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Silver Spring, Md.: Very interesting article today. I am always curious about this viewpoint. I was born her, but had I waited on long lines to get here I'd sure be upset about anyone who jumped that line. I think it is clear that an unregulated flow of illegal immigrants across the border has clearly caused strains to our social systems (specifically those of border states, but more and more the entire country) and depressed the wages of those jobs they compete for (filled previously by the next most recent immigrant wave, surprising not causing more tension between the groups than it has) - However, clearly, this flow is caused by a demand for labor, a demand that our legal immigration system has not adaquately adapted to account for. I am a supporter of drastically fixing our legal immigration system, BUT only after careful analysis, by a third pary completely unaffiliated with US business interests, into how much is "employers can't find workers" and how much is "employers can't find workers at ridiculously unfair wages". Do you feel that these immigrant groups you write about agree that our legal system needs to be fixed? Or do they feel that is not necessary?

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for your thoughtful reading and response. I think stakeholders on all sides agree the system is broken. Even undocumented immigrants tell me they worry about the current border situation because more illegal migration means more competition for them, a possible undercutting of wages, strains on the services they have come to use. Your idea about a third unaffiliated party brokering a deal is an interesting one and I thought that's what government was attempting to be in this case (although they are certainly subject to political, business, constituent and popular interests). And if you look at some of Congress' proposals, many try to do the middle-of-the-road walk: avoiding use of the word amnesty, allowing long-time immigrants to get on a quicker path to green cards while more recent arrivals might be deported, granting certain high-skilled professionals visas that would lead to green cards sooner --and tighter border security, employer fines for hiring illegal workers, possibly a fence... But each of these ideas I just throw out there has a vociferous camp for and against. In reality, I think this is a much more nuanced debate. I hope today's story captured just one element of that.

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Dumfries, Va.: It honestly seems to me that these immigrants are only seeking acceptance from Americans with their anti-immigrant rhetoric. It is also surprising to me that they've seemed to have forgotten the hardships that immigrants face when arriving here, considering that I haven't, and I am only the son of immigrants, not an immigrant myself. I entirely understand there needs to be a serious response to recent immigration, I really do, but it seems to me that people have stopped seeing immigrants as people and more as felons that should be treated like dirt.

S. Mitra Kalita: Just posting this comment, for which I thank you. I was at an event the other night and a young man, also the son of immigrants like you, felt similarly, that it was unfair for immigrants to want to close doors behind them. Certainly there are many legal immigrants who have been marching and rallying alongside illegal workers in recent weeks.

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Alexandria, Va.: There are many illegal immigrants that want to become Americans without going through the regular process that countless immigrants before them have. Since we are a nation of law, and everyone is equal supposedly, why are our lawmakers even considering granting amnesty to the 11-12 million illegals already in our country? This will send the wrong message to potential future illegal immigrants that money and cheap labor are more important than protecting our own workers and their standard of living...The companies who want to employ cheap labor are the main beneficiaries of any such amnesty not the American people...My grandmother was born in Columbia and was proud to assimilate and become an American. She is ashamed now that so many illegals can come here and not have to learn English or assimilate at all it seems. Instead of spending billions on a war with Iraq, that I think we will never win, we should be spending this money to secure our borders and pay to improve schools and health care in our country. Do you agree that many politicians are hoping to get the Hispanic vote in the next election by hoping on the pro-illegal immigrant bandwagon?

S. Mitra Kalita: I do think the Hispanic vote and their future as a large number of voters is interesting and motivating some politicians. But I also would ask the question of where our laws have been over the last few decades as these millions of people crossed our borders and this country and its economy became one increasingly dependent on immigrant labor. It seems to me like it's impossible to turn back the clock now. Any thoughts on this?

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Melbourne, Fla.: Florida has a lot of Cubans and Puerto Ricans, many of them first generation immigrants. The difference between them and other hispanic groups like Mexicans is that they are all gauranteed full legal status. Because of this do you see any conflicts or resentment with the other immigrants? Or do they feel solidarity? Thanks!

S. Mitra Kalita: Yes there is certainly "classism" within the Latino community, and other communities for that matter, based on legal status. However, there have been many wealthy immigrants, too, who have thrown their support behind the marches and more public protests in recent weeks. And others are like the people I wrote about in today's story.

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Alexandria, Va.: You cited a few immigrants, mainly from Asia, as wanting to restrict immigration to the point that it would have prevented their immigrating to the US. Were they even aware of the irony of this stance? It strikes me as the worst kind of hypocrisy.

S. Mitra Kalita: They were but they said that as long as they were in the United States, they wanted to act in what they felt were the best interests of their adopted homeland.

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Washington, D.C.: Good article. I have not seen very much discussion of this issue. Do you think that is because it veers from the received wisdom, which is that most immigrants are Hispanic and all Hispanics support legal and illegal immigration (basically the script that the various marches were trying to put forward)?

S. Mitra Kalita: I think the mainstream media (of which I am a member) might perhaps be guilty of presenting it this way sometimes -- although the Post has certainly done a great number of stories pointing out the complexities of the overall issue, the stakeholders, the immigrants themselves. And this week, I have seen a lot of stories across the country about how this is not just a Latino issue. So I hope the coverage will begin to reflect the nuances I talked about earlier. (Also public opinion polls - cited in today's story - have showed that Hispanics support more open immigration policies at higher rates than other immigrant groups and the overall population.)

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Arlington, Va.: Great Story! Another Post article today indicated that President Bush is losing support among conservatives because of his open-borders philosophy. However, people like Karl Rove are always saying that the Republicans have to be supportive of immigration because Hispanics are the next great voting bloc. Do you think stories like this one will convince people that many immigrants and minorities are actually against immigration, and that staking out a tough position on that issue is not somehow a death sentence for the Republican Party?

washingtonpost.com: Bush, GOP Congress Losing Core Supporters , By Jim VandeHei and Peter Baker

S. Mitra Kalita: My goal is not to convince the Republican Party of that but to perhaps present another side of the debate and to make sure we don't paint all immigrants with one broad brush. Thanks for your comment and question.

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Annapolis, Md: I work for a landscaper, he was in an accident a couple of weeks ago. He had legal transient workers in his truck. They had their paperwork with them. My boss was not at fault in the accident but the policeman started to question him about the legality of the workers. If those workers had not been Hispanic the questioning would never had happened. This definitely reeks of discrimination.

S. Mitra Kalita: Can you please send me your contact information to kalitam@washpost.com. I would be very interested in talking to anyone out there who has seen more examples of cracking down on illegal workers or asking for documentation in the current climate of reform. Thanks!

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Grand Rapids, Mich.: The truth is that illegal immigration is just that, illegal. All other euphemisms distort the issue to the point that an effective dialogue cannot occur. I do not know what you mean by "classism" among Hispanics, unless you mean the "classism" of the oligarchies in Mexico, Latin America and the US being complicit in exporting their working classes to avoid real democratic change in Latin America.

Jose A. Amors

Editor at Large, La Voz

S. Mitra Kalita: A comment. Thanks for it.

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Germantown, Md.: It is obvious from the article that there are many people, other than the "native-born, white Americans", who feel that the open borders must be secured. I am getting a little tired of constantly seeing the media labeling this debate as illegals vs. the "native-born white Americans". The debate involves many people outside of these two classes. I do feel that illegal immigration will cause a great drain on our country. These people are not here legally. They are mostly unskilled laborers who works in occupations that have a great potential of obtaining injuries from the work. Who then pays for their medical care? Our tax dollars! Deporting them may be costly up front, but it will be costly to allow them to stay here.

S. Mitra Kalita: I am sending along this comment and also want to send along a wonderful story that my colleague Darryl Fears did on how some black Americans view the immigration debate.

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washingtonpost.com: Job Issue Muddles Immigration Views , By Darryl Fears, April 8, 2006

S. Mitra Kalita: Here it is.

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Arlington, Va.: Ms. Kalita,

Can you please mention that the Minuteman Project caravan will be arriving in Washington, D.C. and will hold a rally at Upper Senate Park tomorrow (Friday 11am). There is little to no mention of where people can go to support them in our local media.

Thank you for standing up for your fellow citizens at this important time in our country.

S. Mitra Kalita: I am passing this along only to say that I do believe the Minuteman Project has gotten a lot of press in the last few months. (And I will still be calling you for comment.) But I am also interested in hearing from other groups that either have proposed immigration reforms, have studied data to conclude that immigrants do or don't depress wages for Americans, are lobbying Congress in interesting ways, etc.

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Annapolis, Md.: Thank you for writing what many Americans feel that this country will become Balkanized unless new immigrants assimilate to American culture and that is not going to happen if the numbers are too large or under the guise of "diversity" we don't insist they assimilate into our society. It is not racist to say English is our language. Illegal immigration does drive down wages and impacts social services. This isn't about race but it is about culture. The values/social system of many Latin American countries is not what America is about. Yes, they do have strong family values but they also come from cultures where corruption is endemic throughout the society, where there is class stratification and where extreme prejudice exists against other countries. I also understand that many want to escape this environment. But what is missing in the debate is why after so many years countries like Mexico continue to be so underdeveloped when other countries have been able to advance their development? The elites in these societies/governments do not have to change because they have the release valve of sending poor illegal immigrants to the US. Yes, we need guest workers and we need to insure they receive decent wages and support but the US should decide how many come into this country, not Mexico. People in America better wake up for there are many in Mexico who feel illegal immigration is how Mexico can reclaim land they feel is rightly theirs.

S. Mitra Kalita: I have gotten many questions in this hour on what foreign governments can do to keep their workers within their borders, to lift up their own populations. Will post a few more.

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Manassas, Va.: In this debate, I never hear discussions on why so many millions of people risk lives, health, and fortune to live in the US every year.

Most of the illegal immigrants do so because their countries of origin are chronically awash in poverty and corruption. Why don't those who promote "amnesty" for the illegals aren't demanding accountability towards the governments where they come from?

No country in the world is as generous as the US with its immigrants, legal or illegal.

Thanks!

S. Mitra Kalita: Here is another thought along the lines of the above.

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Washington, D.C.: Growing up as a Puerto Rican American, my mother would sometimes talk about the rivalries between the diverse groups lumped under the title of 'Latino' or 'Hispanic'. While my family is 'Americanized', my relatives who grew up in a more traditional environment would often express derogatory or racist views on other hispanic groups; notably Mexicans. While this certainly doesn't speak for all or even most Latinos, a sense of differece does exist for many hispanics. Many Cubans look down on Puerto Ricans, many Puerto Ricans look down on Mexicans, many Mexicans look down on El Salvadorans, etc...

In your article you talk about the other perspectives by immigrant groups, did you see any difference based on race within the hispanic umbrella? Or is the common plight bringing them together, dissolving the national rivalries?

S. Mitra Kalita: For this story, I didn't dwell on race within the communities but yes, it is certainly a factor. Colorism, actually, exists across many ethnic groups, including my own. (Just last month, someone told me that I had been a cuter baby than my daughter because I was lighter-skinned!) But what we are seeing in this current movement highlights the creation of a Latino culture in the United States - one that would only be possible in the United States because it marries people across different countries of origin, in some cases race, etc. And, whatever you think of the marchers' stance, they are certainly banding together across many differences. What they are doing, creating culture while asserting their own, speaking up for their rights, ironically, seems very American.

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Oakland, Calif.: Do natives and legal immigrants who blindly oppose immigration reductions realize that if the current U.S. population growth rates continue, by 2050 -- within the lifetimes of today's college students -- we could have more than 500 million people, which is a projection of the U.S. Census Bureau? This is half of India's current population! Do they realize that if the U.S. just amnestied 12 million illegal aliens, with 10 years, they could add 30 million more people to this country through births here and immigration of their extended families who consume energy, need jobs, health care, education and many other very costly social services? Does the U.S. have an unlimited supply of energy, jobs, etc. for all those who wish to immigrate to this country? The U.S. has massively exported jobs to many countries, such as China and India. If the U.S. continues to massively import workers from China, India and other countries, how can natives and legal immigrants already here find work? Many Chinese legal immigrants have chosen to go back to Hong Kong, Taiwan and China, saying that there are far more opportunities there than here. Americans must wake up! China is rising very fast and the U.S. is falling even faster!

Yeh Ling-Ling

Oakland, Calif.

S. Mitra Kalita: I am posting a comment from Yeh Ling-Ling who was quoted in the story. Thanks for joining us, Ling-Ling. She also has many articles up on the Diversity Alliance web site that expand on these thoughts.

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Dallas, Texas: As a family that benefits from the new markets that have opened up from having Spanish speaking customers (many large consumer brands are marketing to these people), I think the economic benefits of the immigrants are being overlooked. They DO consume retail goods here in the states, and that is good for everyone.

S. Mitra Kalita: Some economists essentially say immigrants balance out the negative effects they have on wages (as in lowering them) by consuming American goods, paying taxes (sales, if nothing else), using their credit cards, buying houses, etc. Thanks for your thought.

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Mayodan, N.C.: I appreciate your article and the recognition of complex nuances on an inflammatory issue typically eliciting polarized responses. In his analysis Donald Horowitz from Duke University cites that the most heterogeneous of societies demand "assimilation" from immigrants more readily than do homogeneous societies. Yet other scholars have found that assimilation program components such as "official language" requirements and "guest worker programs" (i.e., Germany's notion of "heimat") tend to exacerbate divisions and inflame racist practices. Assuming that our recent immigration problems are addressed in a package finally passed by Congress, and given your experience with recent immigrants (legal or illegal), can you anticipate the response of immigrant communities if such assimilation requirements were mandated? Thanks for your response.

S. Mitra Kalita: Wonderful question. It is so hard to legislate assimilation, no? How would you do that beyond making English the nation's official language? And it seems to me that a state of assimilating, even of calling oneself "American" is an emotional, possibly long journey. Yes, perhaps one the government wants people to make. But I don't see how you make it a requirement...

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Long Beach, Calif.: I work for one of the oldest e-Commerce development firms in the U.S. - we've been trying to land Japanese business for years where there is a giant consulting need for American expertise in presenting the midsized co's services/products to Americans... So we invited a gentleman we know to invest in our firm and come over to America to live and work. He is uniquely placed in his community of leading corporate board members... we failed to get the U.S. government to let him in, however. This guy invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in American jobs in a good faith gesture and the Gov't came up with one excuse after another to deny his visa...

This is why I say we need to build the wall. If we're keeping legit business people out who would be creating jobs, then we need to stop being hypocrites and seal the border.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for sharing your story. Can I please have you e-mail me with your information? I have a colleague working on a story that this might relate to. kalitam@washpost.com

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Alexandria, Va.: I found your characterization of the two sides of the debate obnoxiously racist. How, for example, do you reconcile Ray Nagin's comments after Katrina concerning Mexican workers with your view that only whites are anti-immigrant?

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for your comment, although I am sorry you feel that way. I just posted a story about black Americans by Darryl Fears that has the details -- but at least one poll shows that while one-quarter of blacks thought they had been displaced by an immigrant worker, blacks were still less likely than whites to say they wanted to severely curb immigration. Prominent black leaders, too, have come out in favor of the recent activism for legalizing undocumented workers. BUT as I mention in today's story, there are black Americans and other minorities who sit on the board of the Diversity Alliance headed by Yeh Ling-Ling, who want to reduce immigration. Again these are all the complexities that are not reflected in the overly simplistic debate I alluded to in the story as immigrants versus whites -- because it is exactly that, overly simplistic.

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Grand Rapids, Mich.: There is also a Hispanic version of the Minutemen that do not get coverage; they are called Friends of the Border Patrol. Thanks for posting my previous comment, and taking up this issue.

Jose A. Amors

S. Mitra Kalita: Another comment from Jose. Thanks.

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San Francisco, Calif.: You ask that we be respectful this a.m. well I ask the same of those who enmass bombarded and changed my culture illegally.

Forty-nine percent of the population in CA is Latino. Everything is bi-lingual including government jobs.

The injection to the economoy has been remarkable, cars, homes, et.al. A task laid wide open because of legal chicanery. No taxation for the illegals.

New jobs were created for Spanish speaking people. Yesterday, a realtors office openly displayed it's Mexican flag along with the Red/White and Blue.

The illegals are the ones who save money, buy the new cars, homes, et.al because they work for cash. Pay in cash. Save in cash.

Not so the rest of us who are gouzed by taxation -- unless of course we are in the upper 10%

These are crimes against Americans as allowed by our government who has no understand or sense of fair play.

S. Mitra Kalita: Posting this comment. I do appreciate you sharing your thoughts.

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Arlington, Va.: I am an immigrant. My family spent years in line to become citizens. We learned English, pay taxes, and contribute to our communities. I support stricter restrictions on immigration and I do not think I am being hypocritical. I support legal, not illegal, immigration. To argue that I am a hypocrite because I support restrictions that would have made it more difficult if not impossible for me to immigrate here is a red herring because the true issue is that of legalty. I only want people coming here legally. No exceptions. If, for the betterment of this country, we need to limit the number of immigrants we allow in, then I fully support such measures. The fact that I happened to legally immigrate here under a different legal regime is irrelevant. Times change. Laws change. It would be foolish to demand that the laws stay the same for all time.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for your comment.

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Rockville, Md.: How much responsibility does the U.S. have towards the immigrants? Lets face it we went and mucked with the governments of Guatemala and El Salvador. We spray herbicides on drugs crops but frequently the wind carries the poison to food crops and some farmer is without livelihood. We just told Mexico it could not pass a bill decrimilzing possession of marijuana. Maybe some of the people coming here feel like they are part of this country since we run their governments.

S. Mitra Kalita: And another point on the responsibilities of foreign governments.

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Washington, D.C.: It is very difficult for me to hear people blaming the other countries for their lack of development--not that there isn't corruptions or internal problems. However, there is very little understanding of globalization and of how different economic forces are playing out.

One of the big reasons that a lot of people have immigrated from Mexico is because of NAFTA and poor farmers of Mexico could not compete with subsidized American grain from ADM--subsidies that you and I pay for. Our international trade policies promote the interest of U.S. businesses often by denying other countries the ability to protect their native businesses and agriculture.

So when those businesses and family farms collapse after trying to compete with the global, mega- businesses of the U.S. What are people supposed to do? Let their families starve?

We need to recognize immigration as what it is which is one piece of the large, global economic integration. So, people need to think about that when their Reps. and Sens. vote for bills like CAFTA or NAFTA. This is one of the impacts.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for your comment. I do think the current immigration model is much, much different because of globalization, and this idea that people can go back and forth (in the case of the Chinese and Indian business leaders, for example). In some cases, illegal workers tell me they want to be able to do business with their home countries, or even go back home, but they know once they go back, they won't be allowed in -- and that's what keeps them here.

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Bowie, Md.: Just a comment - I am increasingly frustrated by the Main Stream Media's penchant to use "undocumented" vice "illegal". Why are we so afraid to call things what they are? If John Wayne Gacy was offended at my calling him a murderer, why should I care? Other nations are much stricter on immigration than we are. In Japan, if you're arrested for being an illegal alien, you go straight to a processing station, then straight on a plane back to your country of origin - no phone calls, no going back to your apartment to pick up your things, nada. My wife, who is a legal immigrant from a much stricter country, is amazed that the border patrol is not authorized to shoot on sight. While a bit extreme, I bet it would only take a few days to stem the flow.

S. Mitra Kalita: I do use the word "illegal" to refer to illegal workers, illegal migrations. I also, however, use the words "undocumented" and "unauthorized" because sometimes they are more factually correct. Someone coming here on a tourist visa did not come here illegally, for example. If they overstayed their visa, though, that is an illegal action. I try to ask the immigrants I interview how they came over and have the story and its semantics as accurate as possible. There are many debates waging within newsrooms on what the best words are to talk and writer about this debate. I am just giving you my personal parameters.

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Amsterdam, Netherlands: Ms. Kalita,Your article captured several facets of this popular debate. Good job!

As an African-American, I sometimes feel offended when I hear people say that "illegal immigrants are doing the jobs Americans don't want to do." It seems that often the people saying this are the ones who stand to gain financially from illegal labor. It's as if Americans are being painted as lazy--broad stroke yet again. Americans have always worked hard in this country. I feel that illegals are doing the jobs Americans don't want to do for anything less than what it takes to maintain their standards of living. In your interviewing, what have you found to be the main reasons employers are hiring illegal workers. And are any illegal sources commenting on what they desire if they a guest worker program is passed (i.e. benefits, housing, etc)? Thank you!

S. Mitra Kalita: Wonderful to hear from you. Thanks for writing. Employers hire illegal workers for many reasons - perhaps they can't find anyone else, they don't want to pay taxes, they want cheap labor. Views on the guest worker program are mixed. I spent the day at a landscaping company recently and even the workers were divided. Some wanted it the same as it is now: they get a prevailing wage (about $11 per hour), worker's comp, housing allowance and transportation. Others wanted to be put on a path to a green card so they could bring their families over. The employer himself just wanted the program to continue as it is -- 10 months a year -- because he said he could not find Americans who wanted to do the job. (And when I say Americans, I mean immigrants, too.:)

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Washington, DC: Are you as disturbed as I am about the spanish National Anthem?

These people have the nerve to sneak into our back door, force companies to hire spanish language interpreters and create spanish advertisements, and now they create their own United States National Anthem in spanish. This is the problem of illegal imigration at its heart. When people come from other parts of the world to the United States, they work hard to learn our culture, while adding some of their own flavor, learn the language, and assimilate into our ever-changing culture. The Latin American imigrants are pandered to with spanish this spanish that, and in no way assimilate to the American culture. Now they feel they have the right to compose their own anthem.

THE PROBLEM MUST STOP NOW!!!!

S. Mitra Kalita: No comment on the anthem but I am posting yours. Actually one: when I lived in Puerto Rico, we used to sing the U.S. anthem before assemblies and "La tierra de Borinquen donde nacido yo..." afterward. I really really looked forward to the latter.

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Baltimore, Md.: When this immigration issue suddenly became front burner for the entire country (as opposed to the border states) I heard that Latino groups were trying to forge an alliance with Irish groups, because there are so many illegal Irish immigrants in New York, Boston, Chicago, etc. The theory was that, by putting a white, English speaking face in the foreground of the issue, the American people would see immigration in a different light. Has such an alliance formed?

S. Mitra Kalita: I am not sure so someone out there, please let me know. I am going to post an interesting story by a colleague about the Irish in NY.

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washingtonpost.com: Irish Immigration Slips Into Reverse , By Michelle Garcia, Feb. 20, 2006

S. Mitra Kalita: Here it is.

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George Briese - Chicago, IL: History is awash with instances where the majority population uses a derogatory word towards a minority group to perpetuate their superior position in society.

During times of war, conflict or stressful situations, new words are created to debase or dehumanize the enemy enabling a speedy transition to bypass the instinctive moral apprehension to do harm against another.

 The recent CNN show with Gov. Bill Richardson, Sen. Dick Durbin, Anderson Cooper, Lou Dobbs brought the role of media as reporter and as instigator to this now divisive issue. While everyone in that forum used the term 'illegal or undocumented immigrants', Lou Dobbs made it a point to use 'illegal ALIENS'. Mr. Dobbs obviously know his propaganda methods, as he tries to desensitize his listeners from seeing these 'aliens' as real people.

With these facts in mind, are we surprised these derogatory terms were so effectively used by the Nazis for Jews, Khmer Rouge and Darfur to rally their cohorts in exterminating these 'enemies'? What do you think the responsibility of the media when using the 'correct' terms as part of the discussion to separate reporting vs. propagandizing? ?

S. Mitra Kalita: I think we need to be very careful and semantics, labels, etc. matter deeply. Again, that's why I try to tell readers how someone came here and use the right word to describe status. The word "alien" is avoided generally because it is a government term and because most readers associate aliens with spacial beings or somesuch. I don't think that's propaganda; it's word choice to give our readers clarity.

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London, UK: I am American, married to a Brit. I had to leave America, because after filling out the application form for immigration, it became clear that as a retired educator -- and even if I was still teaching -- I would never make a salary large enough for Uncle Sam to consider me a viable sponsor for my highly skilled husband, who makes at least three times more than me. Plus, the INS at the time told us that it would take them 2-3 years just to even begin to process my husband's application, due to their backlog.

During the years my husband was seconded to the corporation he worked for in the US, he paid his income taxes to the US, and was even erroneously called for jury duty.

When his secondment ended, we could no longer stay in my homeland, unless we found a sponsor other than me to help him acquire a green card. So we came to the UK. It was much easier for me to be vetted for permanent residency here than in the US. Only 2-pages for the application.

I am bitterly disappointed and disillusioned that things have worked out the way they have. We have tried everything to go through the process LEGALLY, but to no avail. And now all the illegals are getting a big bonus. What a dysfunctional system we have. But we brought it upon ourselves.

Any ideas? I guess we won't be living back home anytime soon. Thanks.

("What's the point in being legal?" -- http://www.kibbelznbitsbydeb.blogspot.com/)

S. Mitra Kalita: Interesting. Immigration lawyers, out there, can you help? It seems to me like the spouse-sponsorship by a U.S. citizen is the easiest hurdle to surmount in the quest for a green card. I suppose there are exceptions if he came her illegally or didn't want to wait in his country of origin? But I am not an immigration lawyer so perhaps I am mistaken. Also just a note - because I am getting a lot of notes on this - any process of securing green cards to illegal workers will not result in them "cutting a line" or getting ahead of people already waiting years for them. At least that is what I have been told. I think everyone expects this will be a long process.

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Richard Baum - Kenosha, Wisc.: The mere fact that there are 11-20 million 'undocumented workers' working today says a lot about their contribution to sustaining the pace of this economy.

Yeh Ling-Ling and co. are predictably worried about their recent migration and ability to sustain their kind. Studies show that immigrants and their siblings, one or two generations removed from coming over to their new country are the most 'protective' of their status in terms of competition and fear of 'scarce' resources syndrome.

It's now wonder this segment of population most vehemently opposes further 'erosion' of their status.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for your comment.

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Silver Spring, Md.: I think one thing interesting about this debate is that no one is seeing the big picture economy wise. Everyone says we need immigrants for the economy, because the very low wage, low hassle work force is invaluable to a couple core industries like construction, agriculture and the restaurant business. This argument is being used by both american legislatures who are presumable representing the businesses it would benefit and the immigrants themselves.

In response we have a lot of legislation on the table that would give the immigrants instant citizenship. The argument at this point seems to be how many will get this instant citizenship.

What I don't understand is that if we in fact instantly legalize all these people, won't both the new citizens and their old employers then instantly have to start paying taxes. This cheap workforce would no longer be so cheap, right?

S. Mitra Kalita: I don't believe I have heard of anyone potentially getting U.S. citizenship in the time it takes to make oatmeal (but please provide me details if you know something I don't). The plans, as I know it, do require a path to citizenship - registration, verification, sometimes going to a different place to be processed (I am sketchy on details and also all this stuff is still being ironed out so it is evolving).

But I do think you are right -- as soon as many immigrants I have talked to get their green cards, their salaries go up. This leveling of the playing field in certain industries is likely to create the scenario you speak of...

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Washington, D.C.: Two quick comments. First, everything changes once an immigrant arrives. So what she or he wanted before immigration--mainly a chance at the good life--can change after to protection of the good life. That would be as true of people's grandparents who immigrated as it is potentially true of me. Second, I believe many "culture" conflicts are racial conflicts in disguise. Who would admit to racism? I don't know what to do about either of these things except that talking about them probably is helpful.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for sharing - and talking!

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Washington, D.C.: As a contractor to the federal government I have been exposed to both the immigrant visa process and to the immigration court deportation process. Our State Department, hard as it may try is controlled by law as the number and types of visas that may be issued for foreign nationals wanting to immigrate to the United States of America. Unfortunately there are so many who just are unable to wait their turn that they enter our country illegally for "a better way of life and to help our family back home." When the illegal aliens are detained and brought before courts to be deported, they employ every tactic possible to extend their and their family's stay in our country for as long as possible. I have even seen instances of cases going on for over 5 years. Awarding amnesty to this group will not end or even curb our country's problem with illegal aliens. It will only reset the count zero for the number of "illegals" in the country.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for your comment.

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Bethesda, Md.: As someone observing this issue, I am thoroughly convinced that a big dose of racism plays into it. So often I hear about the "horror" of going into a supermarket and -hearing Spanish- that it seems clear to me they are, in part, simply threatened by something different than themselves. I realize it is not that simple, but this is a big element of it.

S. Mitra Kalita: Gracias por su opinion.

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Arlington, Va.: I tend to feel that a lot of the current debate on immigration is outdated. We can debate the issue of what type of imigration should be allowed for years (and have), but the truth is in this global world, people and jobs will tend to move to the most attractive economic locations, whether or not it is legal. Our goal should be to figure out how to manage the flow to avoid problems and how to help people assimilate. Having taught ESL in Arlington, where I worked with many recent immigrants, I can tell you that the stories of those who come here are so incredibly inspiring -- the hardships they have suffered and their faith in the American dream is simply amazing. We have to realize that America doesn't "belong to us" and perhaps it never did. It belongs to those who believe in its ideals and work to make life better. People come here because of their ideals and dreams and belief in what America represents. We should all work to make sure those ideals continue to be respected.

S. Mitra Kalita: Thanks for that thoughtful comment. I am wrapping up here so I am just trying to post a few more comments now.

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Bethesda, Md.: I just wanted to pose a rarely-asked question to all of the vociferously anti-illegal Americans out there. How sure are you that your ancestors immigrated legally? Clearly as porous as our borders may be today, they must have been more so a hundred or so years ago. To be honest I am not even sure if my own ancestors had all the right paperwork - though no one is going to question it now.

S. Mitra Kalita: I believe it wasn't until the 1920s that "paperwork" was even required. My immigration history might be rough here.

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Woodbridge, Va: One aspect of the issue no one seems to discuss is the administrative mess at the State Department. Not only is the legal process for immigrating to the U.S. unnecessarily complicated but anyone who has ever delt with either the passport office or worse yet the immigration office quickly learns that State Department employees are rude, disfunctional and totally uninterrested in customer service. For many years the regional INS offices have been a dumping ground for the worst slackers in the civil service. These people make your local DMV look motivated! Part of reforming the immigration system has to include cleaning up the mess at visa desks in our embassies and INS field offices in the U.S.

S. Mitra Kalita: This is one area I wrote about in a story two weeks about about a group called "Immigration Voice" lobbying for the green card processing backlog to be fixed as part of this immigration overhaul.

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washingtonpost.com: Skilled Immigrants Turn to K Street , April 26, 2006

S. Mitra Kalita: Here is that story.

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McLean, Va.: Thank you for writing this article. It is very important to show this side of the discussion. How or Why did you write this article? How did you come about writing on this topic? How were you choosen to handle this issue? What is your view on the immigration debate?

S. Mitra Kalita: I think this is a fitting question for me to end today's chat on. I cover immigration for the financial desk of the Post. In the course of the last few weeks, I have interviewed dozens of people on all sides and those sitting right on the fence. Many of them on the side of wanting to curb immigration were immigrants -- and I felt nobody's coverage was reflecting that. I also am fascinated by the various movements at play in this surge of all-around activism we are seeing. So I pitched a story to my editor and the result is what you read today. I have written about a number of topics as a journalist: business, education, crime, government. But immigration has been a thread I keep coming back to. I suppose it is partly because I am the daughter of immigrants from India; I was born in Brooklyn, lived in Puerto Rico as a child, consider myself American. But I always tell people that when I write about immigration, I consider myself a journalist first--and that requires me to fairly look at the many facets, sides, complexities of this debate.

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S. Mitra Kalita: Okay, everyone, we are totally over our time and there are still more than 100 questions in queue. But this has been a lively, interesting chat and I hope we can do it again soon. Remember to stay in touch at kalitam@washpost.com -- I await your ideas!

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