The 'Lost' Hour: Season 5 - '316'
Thursday, February 19, 2009; 3:00 PM
Has "Lost" got you a mite confused and ready to hurl at the next mention of smoke monsters? Or do you have the fate of the Oceanic 6 and the Jack-Kate-Sawyer-Juliet love square all figured out? Who got Scooby Dooed this week? Are you a new viewer, adrift on an unfamiliar isle or an old hand ready to bare knuckle some quantum physics? In either case, we're here for you and armed with more mediocre puns and pop culture references than a hunky con man can shake a stick at.
Post.com "Lost" bloggers Liz Kelly and Jen Chaney will attempt to get to the bottom of these matters every Friday. Liz and Jen, both obsessive "Lost" fans, have been writing their weekly dueling analysis of the show since 2006.
When not debating the merits of Sawyer's hotness, Liz Kelly writes the Celebritology blog and Jen Chaney acts as movies editrix and DVD columnist for washingtonpost.com.
For episode analysis, discussion transcripts and more, visit washingtonpost.com's Lost Central.
Liz Kelly: Jen will be surprised to learn that the first thing I want to talk about today is Kate.
I'm intrigued by the discussion going on over in the analyis comment of a possible Kate pregnancy. It does make a crazy kind of sense. As one reader pointed out, there was a pregnant woman on the original Oceanic flight, so that would put them one step closer to recreating the original conditions and, well, Kate and Jack totally got it on. So it is a definite possibility.
And in retrospect (it's hard to catch/analyze everything within the couple of hours after the show) it's just possible that someone talked to Kate and told her she had to go back and had to get intimate with Jack before she got on that plane. It would parallel someone -- Charlie, we assume -- getting to Hurley and sending him along with the guitar and even Jack was tasked with putting his dead pop's shoes on John.
So I'm definitely interested in getting everyone else's thoughts on this. By the end of the hour we can hopefully spin this into Kate and Jack (who seem to have been dropped into the island in the 1970s) being the parents of one of the present day characters.
Finally, thank you to reader Laura118 for verbalizing what I was thinking: "Kate looked like a crack addict heading to detox." Yes, she did. But even I can forgive her that seeing as how she just lost/gave up Aaron.
Jen Chaney: I too am in love with the pregnancy theory. I mean, for some so distraught, she got hot for Foxy pretty fast. And, I mean, I can *understand* that. But the notion that she had to be with child -- which, again, also offers her redemption for lying about being Aaron's mom and being pregnant the first time around -- is really intriguing.
But why don't you tell us what you think?
W-A-A-A-A-A-A-A-L-T!, Ohio: Seriously? No Walt on the plane?
Jen Chaney: Oh, Walt's coming back. Next week, as a matter of fact.
In a related question, why weren't the flight attendants more suspicious of what was going on? I mean, Ben's all battered, everyone's all tense, Hurley bought half the seats on the flight...
Liz Kelly: Yeah, you'd think that in the post 9/11-world all sorts of bells and whistles would have been going off in the crew's brains. Especially after Hurley freaked out at seeing Ben.
Falls Church, Va.: Hi Jen and Liz -- Posting early because I have to be in a meeting during the chat (boo!). Anyhow, in your analysis this morning, you posited that "Locke is a proxy for Christian Shephard" ... but I think perhaps that Locke is actually a proxy for Aaron. Aaron is clearly "special" (the second-coming man-child?). Locke is clearly identified as a proxy -- but a proxy for whom? With all the Jesus = Locke stuff going on in last night's episode (Jack as Doubting Thomas, etc.), it makes more sense to me that Jesus = Aaron = Locke. What do think?
Jen Chaney: I think my head just exploded.
Oakton, Va.: Is something going on at the Orchid? The Orange line keeps disappearing.
Liz Kelly: Nice. I think we have only Metro to thank for that. Unless there's some kind of telluric current running under Courthouse.
Vienna, Va.: What is up with Jack's grandfather (Ray) suddenly appearing in Season 5? And why does he look way too young to be Christian's father?
The only thing I think we ever heard of him is (if I remember right) Christian once said his father was a great man. That didn't give me the impression that he was talking about someone still alive and living in a home. Plus, we are being led to believe that Christian is a supernatural being of unknown age and origin.
This all leads to the possibility that Ray is not actually Christian's father at. Buy then, who is he and why?
Liz Kelly: Well I doubt Jack would call the guy granddad if he hadn't at least been raised thinking this guy was his grandfather. I was more interested in the fact that Ray seemed to attempt his escape in order to get Jack there and give him Christian's shoes. Like he was in on the whole thing. Who knows -- maybe Christian has appeared to dear old dad, too.
Jen Chaney: Wouldn't surprise me either if Granddad Shepard's escape attempt wasn't orchestrated.
And speaking of, I enjoyed seeing the white rabbit during the magic show. No numbers on him, though.
Fairfax, Va.: Along with all the other biblical references in "316," in the Bible Jacob was Aaron's great-grandfather -- perhaps making Ray the island Jacob. Also, if I remember correctly, Jacob had 12 sons, the youngest one being Benjamin. Benjamin's mother died in childbirth.
Jen Chaney: Nice reminders. We didn't have time to delve into all that biblicology -- hey, Liz, perhaps a sideblog for Celebritology? -- in our analysis, but thanks for reminding everyone of the relationships there.
Liz Kelly: Another sideblog? Sheesh.
Bowie, Md.: Why doesn't Jack ever ask Ben the appropriate questions? This week he should have asked "What happened to you and your face?"
Jen Chaney: No kidding. The good doctor never asks follow-up questions. And more to the point, why confide in Ben re: his feelings about Locke? That was a pretty intimate conversation to have with a guy he wanted to murder 24 hours ago.
Liz Kelly: I think Jack just needed someone, anyone to talk to and Ben just happened to be there. Plus, we're seeing the dawning of a new Jack Shepherd -- he's a man who takes leaps of faith now, so maybe he was softening toward Ben the slightest bit.
Though I would totally have smacked Ben upside the head for that "My mother taught me," quip.
Jen Chaney: No you wouldn't. You love Ben now. You think he's the nicest guy ever.
Liz Kelly: Nut unh. I'm back on the fence. He was downright mean last night -- and if he killed Penny, well then all the more reason to totally hate his guts.
Kate pregnant?: Maybe it will happen as plot development, but it's a pretty bogus "pregnancy" for all of 36 hours. At that point, fertilization may not have even taken place.
Jen Chaney: Maybe the child just had to have been conceived before she got on the plane? Given the need to recreate the previous flight, I think it makes a lot of sense.
Wonder if Hurley also had some of Charlie's heroin in that guitar case...
Liz Kelly: Exactly -- if she was ovulating at just the right moment, anytnhing's possible. And we already know that these people's lives seem to be guided by something supernatural. It wouldn't be out of the question for this to have been pre-ordained.
Ben going back to the island: I thought that once Ben turned the Frozen Donkey Wheel that he could not come back to the island, so I don't understand how/why he is on the plane. Am I missing something?
Liz Kelly: No, you're not. My thinking is that Ben is trying to change the rules and return anyway. We'll see how the island likes that.
Dupont Circle: Can we talk about Jin in his Dharma outfit?
Liz Kelly: Okay, you go first...
Jen Chaney: The question there: did everyone shift to the '70s again? Was it just Jin?
Tunisia: I've been thinking about bloodied Ben and my Brutha Desmond...
Could it be that since Desmond wasn't on the original Oceanic flight and since he got to the Island in a different vehicle he really didn't need to be on the plane to get back. In fact, he WOULDN'T have gone back since that is not how he originally got there. That is why Ben and Hawking don't really react when he leaves the Lamppost. Which brings me to bloodied Ben. He went to kill Penny to make up for Widmore killing his daughter. Which will trigger Desmond coming back to the island "his way" to either fix what happened or to kill Ben. I feel like Penny is one of the few disposable characters at this point.
Also, This may be even more of a reach. In season 1 Kate goes to the pond we saw them in in "316." Could it be that Hurley, Jack and Freckles landed where the Tailies and the escort for Kate originally crashed? Which would place everyone else back on the beach? A stretch I know.
I love the Templar connections!!
Liz Kelly: Right -- I'm totally with you on the Desmond story line. He's going to go back to the island for a reason -- whether to avenge Penny or something else. As Ms. Hawking said over-acted, "The island's not done with him yet."
Liz Kelly: Oh, and good point -- I think that was the same pond/waterfall where she and Sawyer found the Halliburton case of guns.
Jen Chaney: Agree that Desmond would not have gone back on the plane. In fact, given his "specialness," his presence could have knocked the wormhole totally out of whack, for all we know.
But what you just said about Penny makes me think that maybe Ben tried to kill her, and perhaps even appears to have done so from Desmond's perspective, but that she isn't actually dead. I say that only because I don't think the writers will end the show by having Desmond not be with Penny. They like Des too much.
As I said (I think?) in our analysis, I loved that they hinted that something may have happened without really saying anything further. It raised the level of suspense in a way that is both horrible and delicious.
I also loved that moment at the very end when you weren't sure who was going to get out of the VW bus. At this point in the show, honestly, aren't you just thinking: "This could be anybody! It could be Charlie! It could be Jin! It could be Nikki or Paolo! It could be Zachary Levi from "Chuck"!" Anything is possible.
Liz Kelly: I was thining it was going to be Roger Workman. But I'm glad it was JIn.
Anonymous: Christian Shepherd tells Locke he must sacrifice.
Ben cites biblical chapter and verse to cast Jack as doubting Thomas.
We're tripping over C.S. Lewises, one of whom the most famous 20th century Christian apologist.
As a kid, I was furious when I realized Aslan was a stand-in for Jesus: Lewis was ruining a whacking great story by turning it into Bible stuff.
And now Lost....? Is it turning -- or revealing itself -- as a Christian parable all along? Please, no.
Jen Chaney: Here's my feeling on that: I think really devout Christians can read the Narnia books or watch "Lost" and take away something really deep and personal and potentially see it as parable.
I also think one can watch, as I do, and be fascinated by those connections without thinking that the writers are trying to jam Christianity down my throat. I don't see the biblical undertones as undermining the story, is what I'm trying to say. But I am curious about how other people feel about that.
Liz Kelly: Another way to look at it is that the writers are drawing inspiration from a story that has inspired writers of all stripes for centuries.
I don't see it as any different than George Lucas drawing on Norse and other mythologies to inspire his "Star Wars" movies (the good ones).
Like Jen says -- you can take it or leave it.
The Lamppost: If I was Desmond, I think I would have grabbed the pendulum and stopped it from swinging before I stormed out, just to screw everything up. Especially if I was that mad about the whole situation. What do you think would happen if it stopped?
Liz Kelly: Honestly? I think Ms. Hawking would have been annoyed, but would have gotten the whole apparatus back up and running within 15 minutes.
Milwaukee: I'm sorry to report I thought all the scenes with Eloise Hawking lacked oomph. First of all, everyone was sort of blase about her -- Sun didn't even ask how she knew Jin was alive (which was the whole reason she was there!). Desmond didn't ask how she popped up in his memories after the hatch imploded. Hawking just seemed to be a big plot device.
Looks like bad news for Penny though. Wasn't Ben phoning Jack all bloody and bruised from a harbor? And he seems pretty smug at the end of the episode, not as if he failed in his task.
Liz Kelly: I'm glad you brought this up. Fionnula Flanagan is seriously over-acting her part. The loaded looks over her shoulder, the whole Bedknobs and Broomsticks-esque church lair, and the over-emoted delivery of her lines.
She needs to calm down. Every time she was on-screen I thought I was watching some kind of tweener made for TV ghost story movie of the week.
Jen Chaney: And good point about Sun. She took that whole ring thing from Ben as her proof. Which Jin actually gave to John to prove he was dead.
And I repeat: Where is Ji-Yeon? She's been abandoned by both of her parents. I realize her grandmother is watching her, but it seems like Sun should have thought twice about taking this trip, especially in light of what you point out: She has no absolute proof that Jin's alive.
Arlington, Va.: How is Locke able to hang himself so easily off-island while Michael could do nothing to kill himself?
Liz Kelly: Because for Locke it was meant to be -- we've known for weeks now that he would have to die for the 06 to return. When Michael tried to kill himself the island wasn't done with him yet.
Jen Chaney: Yes, the island Michael to help blow up the freighter. Personally, I think the island also needs him to yell "Waaallt!" a few more times. But that's me.
In ABC's eyes, apparently the island needs him to be on a new show with Adam Goldberg...
Ohio: I'd love to hear some theories on what Kate did with Aaron... Who is he with? Claire's mom (she was in town, after all)? Sawyer's babymama? Nanny?
Liz Kelly: And what was it that convinced Kate to return to the island. It definitely wasn't because Jack was going, no matter what she said.
Jen Chaney: No. I think Claire's mom is a good call. We still don't know the full extent of Jack's conversation with her. In the scene where they spoke, the camera cuts away.
So if she does know about Aaron and she came to Kate and said, I am supposed to care of this child, he's my grandson, well, that's a pretty powerful argument. Or, better yet, the lawyer (aka Mr. Chase from "My So-Called Life"), who is working on Ben's behalf, may have conveniently clued her in and had the child taken away.
Liz Kelly: Or, option number three, Charles Widmore somehow got a hold of little Aaron.
Please clarify Jin's expression: Did he recognize Kate, Jack, and Hurley? Also, how do you think he integrated with the Dharma people, getting to wear their threads and driving around their vans and what not. I mean, how does he explain himself when he shows up at their door? What is going on?
Liz Kelly: I think he must have -- seeing as how he knew who Danielle Rousseau was when he encountered her as a young woman on the beach.
Jen Chaney: Right. Again, this assume he's still flashing around. Remember, Locke supposedly stopped the island from flashing but the wider world is not running on the same time as island world so who knows if the island is still flashing?
Personally, I could not tell whether or not he recognized them. He seemed perplexed, but I almost thought he was more surprised that these random people knew his name. But it could go either way.
Liz Kelly: Right -- Doc Jensen pointed out that although Locke stopped the flashes when he put the Frozen Donkey Wheel back on its axis, it will take the story a couple of shows for the effects of the flashes to get us all on the same page. So, basically, what Jen said.
Herndon, Va.: Is it possible that a time traveling Jin taught the younger Charlotte how to speak Korean?
Liz Kelly: Nice call.
Jen Chaney: Oh, I like you, Herndon.
Gaithersburg, Md.: If Jack knows he is going back to the island why would he wear a suit?
Liz Kelly: Because he was recreating the conditions from the first time around -- when he was wearing a suit.
Washington, D.C.: Penny is easily the worst character on this show. All she does is stare at Desmond like she just farted or something. Would her loss really be that bad?
Liz Kelly: Wow -- Claire Danes everyone. (Only folks who came here from the Celebritology chat will get that.)
Me, I like Penny. But compared to Kate, the rest of them are all swell -- even the exaggeratedly spooky Ms. Hawking.
Jen Chaney: You know, there is no need to mock Kate when she's just lost her pseudo-son.
Liz Kelly: Oh, she can't hear me.
"What is the deal with Michael Jackson?":
The actor who offered condolences to Jack in the airport played an Iraqi Republican Guard interrogator that tortured Mark Wahlburg just after the first Gulf War in the movie" Three Kings."
Just a shout out, or will him being the only other passenger in first class end up important storywise. I hope so, he's a great actor.
washingtonpost.com: Scene from "Three Kings" (NSFW)
Liz Kelly: That's right my main man. And the marshal who was apparently escorting Sayid to Guam -- Zuleikha Robinson -- starred opposite Kal Penn in "The Namesake" and played salty slave Gaia on HBO's "Rome."
Jen Chaney: Which is all good information. But still doesn't explain why the heck she arrested Sayid. Just because he killed a few people? Since when is that a crime?
Lostie: I have a suggestion y'all. I remember from last week, a blogger mentioned about seeing the show at a cinema and drafthouse. Is there a way that could happen in Arlington with maybe a discussion afterward with Jen and Liz?
Liz Kelly: I love that idea, though it would make it pretty hard for us to write our analysis -- what with the beering and the discussing. We may be able to work something out. We'll take it up with our boss lady.
Jen Chaney: Friends don't let friends drink and analyze "Lost." That said, perhaps we could make an exception.
Richmond, Va.: I don't have the DVDs to refer back to, but wasn't Claire told by a fortunate teller (or something) that the baby (Aaron) HAD to be raised in L.A.?
Jen Chaney: A psychic, yes. In season one. At the time, I thought he just said that to get her on the plane because she needed to be on the island. (Which also could still be true.) But in retrospect, it does seem more meaningful.
Washington, D.C. : Jin looked pretty spiffy in his Dharma jumpsuit -- did anyone catch a glimpse of a name tag? Considering all workers were given a name tag based on their job duty, that may tell us if Jin's working for the Dharma Initiative!
And, if I may add, I'm pretty bothered by the fact Ben said, "my mother taught me" on the airplane with Jack. Ben's mom died giving birth to him, right?
Jen Chaney: I didn't catch a name tag. But I haven't had a chance to look at screenshots today, so maybe someone else has seen one.
Ben's mom did die in childbirth, as several of you already pointed out. Was that comment meaningful in some way, or was Ben just being snarky? I actually don't know the answer. I'm inclined to say meaningful since, you know, this was a LindeCuse-written episode and they don't tend to toss in little asides for nothing.
Liz Kelly: Unfortunately all the screengrabs of Jin are cropped above where the nametag would be.
Austin, Tex.: My husband and I just got back from your honeymoon in Hawaii - needless to say it was lovely, but I'd like to share one particular experience - on our last day there we were walking up some random street just outside of Waikiki when my husband noticed this warehouse-looking building a little off the road and a red phone booth among other things - it looked like the one from The Constant episode so we looked closer and saw a sign for "Santa Rosa Mental Health Clinic" (or something). That really got our interest so we walked through some itchy grass to see what's on the other side of the building; and THEN - there it was, casually leaning against a wall surrounded by random wood pieces and some Egyptian thing, our good friend - the donkey wheel!! Oh the fun! I don't think I'm easily star-struck, but looking at Wheely through this barb-wired fence got me giddy like a schoolgirl at the sight of Matthew Fox!
washingtonpost.com: No pictures for us?
Jen Chaney: Wow, we need more details! What was the wheel like? Was it nice? Did it look supernatural and glowy? Did it have anything bad to say about Ben?
Liz Kelly: I am so jealous.
Sun: Sun totally has a plan. She is tough and in charge now. She wouldn't take her daughter on the plane because she couldn't risk the girl not surviving the crash (not one of the O6), and because she has no intention of staying. She seems to clearly blame Ben, jack and Kate for Jin's death. I think she plans to go in, get Jin, and leave. She has means and information now and doesn't care what happens to the O6. After all, they abandoned Jin.
Jen Chaney: I get that. But it was hard enough to get off the island. And as Ms. Hawking made quite clear, there are only certain windows when one can get back and -- I assume -- leave. So just grabbing the hubby and leaving seems kind of complicated, no?
Washington, D.C.: Anyone else think Grandpa Ray was a little too young? And why would Jack start off calling him Ray and then switch up to Grandpa the rest of the scene?
Liz Kelly: Maybe he wasn't particularly close to his grandfather. I had a grandfather, my mom's stepfather actually, who my brothers and I all called "Russ." We would introduce him as our "grandfather," but address him directly as "Russ."
There's something weird going on there for sure, but I don't think that means the guy isn't Jack's grandpa.
Washington, D.C.: Did anyone else notice the extraordinary amount of blinking by Jack and Kate this episode? It's so annoying...
Liz Kelly: They were blinking back tears, no?
Jen Chaney: I was blinking at the exact same times they were, so I never noticed.
liz: This is the image of Jin I referenced above.
Burke, Va.: Were you disappointed that it was soooo easy to get back on the island? You have this multi-billionaire Widmore trying for 20 years to get back, and all Jack and company had to do was get on a commercial flight from LA to Guam?
Liz Kelly: Right. And as Producer Paul points out, if Widmore knew where Ms. Hawking was then he certainly knew about the Lamppost and the pendulum -- meaning he should have been able to storm the castle so to speak.
Also, since he's apparently got access to all data on every computer network in the world I would think he would have had someone watching for flights on which all six of the Losties were booked and moved heaven and earth to get himself on that flight.
Jen Chaney: These are all good points. So is he really trying to find the island? Or -- and I swear someone else may have suggested this, either here or in a blog comment or somewhere -- is he trying to get back there at a certain moment in time because he thinks he can change the rules and perhaps change things that transpired there?
Foucalt's Pendulum: Am I the only one who thinks it is interesting that Eloise Hawking never confirmed that she was Farrady's mother? Also, she spoke about a great man who built that room. Was she talking about Farraday?
Finally, one of you referenced Umberto Eco's book "Foucault's Pendulum" in the dueling analysis. You should remember that the 600 year old "Plot" was (spoiler alert) actually just a gag made up as part of a game played by the narrator and his friends and was (further spoiler alert) entirely based on a note that had been mistranslated.
Liz Kelly: Good point. The same thought crossed my mind when Desmond delivered his message. She didn't confirm that she was Daniel's mother or that Desmond had fully discharged his duty.
As for "Focault's Pendulum," I'm not done reading yet. But I thought the conceit was that although they make up the plot -- and make it up from some rather elaborate actual research -- that it turns out they've stumbled upon the truth.
Arlington, Va.: If Kate's pregnant, who is her son/daughter? We have most likely met him or her since they seem to have landed in the past and this kid would have been a teen to young adult by the time 2004 rolled around.
Liz Kelly: Right -- that's the question. If we spin this theory out and they had a kid on the island in the 70s, that kid would be at least in his or her 20s by 2004.
Jen Chaney: This is where my brain starts to hurt a little bit.
Sigh: Liz and Jen,
I think you're both totally cool.
Even though you never post my comments.
Jen Chaney: There. We posted that one!
We want to post everything, seriously, there are just so many questions. Honestly, we -- or at least I -- can't even read them all some weeks. Regrettably.
Washington, D.C.: This isn't a question regarding last night's episode, specifically. And for all I know this question has been hashed and re-hashed ad nauseum. But last night's episode for some reason made me wonder if the writers for the show actually had the show planned out this far in advance or if they started out without any real clue of where they were going. I mean, I know it probably wouldn't have won too many viewers if they hit us over the head with all the spirituality/Bible-ness (yes, I know that's not a word) right from the get go. But did they really intend to fill the story with SO MANY religious and spiritual over- and under-tones? Or did it just start out small and build upon itself, to the point where they just had to roll with it?
Liz Kelly: I think from what we've heard from LindeCuse it's a little of both. They had some ideas about what would inform the show, but the mythology grew with each episode. And only this season have they been freed to get knee-deep into it. Jen and I love it, but I know it's also turning off some casual viewers -- like my mom (hi mom) who calls me after the show each week now to say, "This show is getting weird."
Jen Chaney: I love that. "Getting." As if initially, it was more like, you know, "According to Jim."
I think there were always some of those undertones, but they are much more obvious now, certainly than in the first season. The first season was really driven by how the characters would survive, not by when the island is or why they had to input numbers into an old computer, or whatever.
Once they got into the Hatch, that was the gamechanger.
Liz Kelly: As Evangeline Lilly put it, the earlier seasons were more driven by the relationships between the characters. Last season -- and this season so far -- we are getting more plot-driven episodes. But, according to Lilly the second half of this season will return somewhat to exploring the relationships. The writers just want to position us correctly first.
Aaron...Aaar, ON: "Don't ever ask me about Aaron again?" Um, I think that's a rational question for Jack to ask about his own nephew. Did she give him to Claire's mum or just leave him by the side of the road?!
Jen Chaney: Look, he won't even ask Ben why his arm is in a sling and half his face is swollen to the size of a grapefruit. He's not going to ask that question, especially after Kate said not to.
Claire's fortune teller: No, no, he told her Aaron had to be raised by HER... she couldn't give him up for adoption. He finally relented and said it'd be okay to go to let the nice couple in LA adopt him, first you just have to get on this nice flight over the ocean...
Jen Chaney: Okay. Didn't he say she had to go to L.A., though? In a persuasive way?
I don't know, maybe I am remembering that wrong. It's possible. I barely know when I am right now.
Season 5 Tagline: Anybody else think that the tagline on the Season 5 DVD should be: "OMG its Jin!" ?
Jen Chaney: This is just the "OMG, it's ..." season period. OMG, it's ... Jin! OMG, it's ... Rousseau. OMG, it's ... Lapidus!
Liz Kelly: OMG it's Ms. Hawking over-acting!
Anonymous: Maybe Charlotte is Freckles Jr.?
Jen Chaney: She said her mom took her to England, though. Which led me to believe mum might be British.
Liz Kelly: Same here. Unless she is Freckles Jr., but was led to believe her mom was someone else because Kate and Jack somehow don't end up staying back in the 70s with her.
Jen Chaney: Does anyone else ever feel like all of us are stretching a little with this stuff?
"Oh my God, what if Aaron is actually Hurley's dad, and Cheech Marin is really Boone's second-cousin twice removed..."
We know they are all connected, and I do believe there are deeper connections in some cases. But sometimes we -- and I include myself in that -- crack me up in our desire to find the missing branches in the "Lost" family tree.
Liz Kelly: Jen, if you're just realizing now that we stretch this stuff sometimes I think maybe a visit to Santa Rosa is in order.
Jen Chaney: Oh, I realized. It's just that sometimes the comedy of it reaches new heights.
Ohio: But is it even possible for Kate to have a baby on the island in the 70s? Remember what Juliet said before - there hadn't been a successful pregnancy on the island.
Liz Kelly: Not in her time there. All she knows about what happened on the island before she arrived is what Ben told her. And, well, Ben's a liar.
Ben: This seems to jive with your and Doc Jensen's analyses: I'm getting the sense (from Ms. Hawking, etc.) that Ben is a necessary evil, for lack of a better phrase, that all involved with the island have to deal with. Kind of like an annoying coworker that we'd all rather not have to work with, but who performs a skill that no one else can do, so we'd all be lost without him and therefore put up with him. I think Ben is such a part of island lore/history/knowledge, that everyone needs him, or wants him dead, for various reasons, but no one really takes him super seriously since they know he's a rogue.
Liz Kelly: So you're saying Ben is the Dwight Shrute of "Lost." Okay, I can buy that.
And I meant to mention this in an earlier answer -- speaking of untrustworthy characters, I think we should include Ms. Hawking in that category. Not only did she play it totally ambiguous when Des delivered his message, but Des even came out and said that she wasn't trustworthy. He clearly remembered her from his earlier encounter -- and he made a point of telling Jack to ignore anything she says to do.
Like Jen says, I don't think any lines in this episode can be considered throw-aways. Especially not those particular exhanges.
Jen Chaney: I don't know, I think people seriously hate him. Sayid? Yeah, he's not fooling when he says he could make things unpleasant for Ben.
Charlotte, NC: Maybe poor Carl is Jack and Kate's love child!
Liz Kelly: That thought crossed my mind, but I doubt it -- he was only one step above a red shirt in the show heirarchy.
Here's the psychic quote: Psychic: I can tell you, this is important. Claire: Okay. Psychic: It is crucial that you, yourself, raise this child. Claire: You, you mean with Thomas, is he - Psychic: No the father of the child will play no part in it's life, nor yours. Claire: So what exactly are you saying? Psychic: This child parented by anyone else, anyone other than you...danger surrounds this baby. Claire: Danger? Psychic: Your nature, your spirit, your goodness must be an influence in the development of this child Claire: Look, if, if Thomas and I don't, you know, get back together I, I'm putting this baby up for adoption. I just, I just wanted to find out what would give the baby the happiest life. Psychic: There is no happy life. Not for this child - not without you. Claire: I don't... Psychic: Look, there can't be another. You mustn't allow another to raise your baby
Jen Chaney: Nice. Thanks for the refresher.
Lynchburg, Va.: Could the eyeliner man be Kate and Jack's son?
Jen Chaney: Look, anything is possible. Personally, I think Liz is their daughter. Would explain why Liz has such resentment toward Kate (mommy issues!), and also why Liz's "mom" thinks the show is too weird...
In all seriousness, though, this does make me think about that long-gestating theory that Jack and Kate are somehow the Adam and Eve of the island, or connected to them in some way. (I am referring to the corpses found in season one...)
Liz Kelly: I do have an awful lot of freckles and am prone to acting like an idiot. Hmmm, you may be on to something.
Liz Kelly: Okay, thanks to everyone for the very good questions. We'll see you back here next week.
Jen Chaney: I'm outta here, too. Off to Guam!
See you here next Thursday at 3.
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