China: 60th Anniversary of Communist Revolution

Parading Military Strength Through Tiananmen Square

Washington Post staff writer Steven Mufson was online from Beijing on Thursday, Oct. 1, at 11 a.m. ET to discuss the 60th anniversary of the Communist Revolution in China, which will feature its first parade in 10 years, spotlighting a modern military, including 108 missiles and the latest defense equipment. It's been 20 years since the Tiananmen Square protests and security forces are on guard against possible disruptions by ethnic Uighurs. How will the U.S. and other world powers react to the "new" China?

China's Gala Show of Strength

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Steven Mufson: China's Communist Party still brooks no rivals; moreover, dissidents, Uyghurs, Tibetans and many others won't feel as though they have much to celebrate this Oct. 1.
But I'm in Beijing and tonight I've been watching the beautifully choreographed evening portion of the National Day bash thrown in Tiananmen Square to mark the 60th anniversary of the Communists' 1949 victory in China's civil war. And I can't help wondering about the phenomenon of a revolution being commemorated by a musical variety show. Think of it as Mao meets Elton John. I'm not criticizing. After all, this past summer I sat in front of the Capitol on July 4 listening to Barry Manilow among others. So who can criticize?
Besides, maybe this is a good phenomenon. Think of what might happen if every political movement were turned into an upbeat musical? Many lives might be saved.
On the street outside on my way back from getting some food, I saw people running to get a glimpse of the fireworks. They wouldn't be running to hear the brief speech President Hu Jintao delivered about socialism with Chinese characteristics. Tonight's massive fireworks display.
Tonight's song and dance shows what can be done by a talented director like Zhang Yimou, who started out making moving (and banned) movies such as the Yellow Earth and Raise the Red Lantern. But the pageant also shows what happens when a governing ideology loses some of its punch and when a country's citizens start to go their own way. Days like this become entertainment as much as a political statement.

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Hainan, China: Why is the media so obsessed with highlighting the military part of the celebration? I just finished watching the evening celebrations and there was zero military, just singing, dancing and fireworks galore. The daytime parade also had thousands of dancers and to be frank, watching it one could easily have missed the parade of military segments. It's nothing more than when the military bands play in the Rose Parade or flybys by jets during the Fourth of July. The country is trying to have some fun and to celebrate. There was a significant emphasis on peace in symbols during the festivities. Western coverage was extremely biased, even using words like "gaudy" to describe the floats, which I thought were great! Why not an article on how they coordinated the whole thing, simply amazing.

Steven Mufson: Thanks for the good question and points. Yesterday I wrote more about the politics of the celebration, today more about the military parade. I agree with your basic point, but the size and emphasis on the military equipment and prowess was just greater here than in the U.S. or France or someplace like that these days. It's just not in the same category as a July 4 flyover.

As for the quality of the performance and floats, I agree that they were very impressive just as the opening of the Olympics was very impressive.

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washingtonpost.com: For China, a March of Progress (Post, Sept. 30)

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China, Shanghai: A visiting American scholar told me a secret: "Why the Western media are so biased against China -- the FEAR."

Steven Mufson: Fear is definitely a part of how many Americans see China these days -- fear of Chinese imports, Chinese greenhouse gases and in some cases of Chinese military modernization. I don't the media is afraid; it's just describing what others are feeling. Fear, as FDR said, isn't that productive a sentiment unless one really tries to address the issues behind it.

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Boston, Mass.: We really don't understand China and its national interests very well and it hurts our dealings with them bilaterally as well as when we are relying upon them in a multilateral situation like Iran. I can't remember where but I finally read recently a good, common sense overview of why it is not in China's interest to approve further sanctions in Iran: China's increased economic ties to Iran, it's recent energy deals in the country, the value of Iran's emergence strategically as a counterweight to US involvement and influence in the Middle East, etc. Why do the "realists" on Obama's foreign policy team seem so naively optimistic that they will get China on board for further sanctions when it is realistically not in their national interests?

Steven Mufson: I hope you read about this in an article by my colleague John Pomfret, who spent five years or so here for the Post after the four years I spent here for the Post as the Bejing correspondent.
I think diplomats in both Republican and Democratic administrations have hoped that China would see non-proliferation, whether by Iran, Pakistan or North Korea, as something that is definitely not in their interest. China tends to stick to its line of "non-interference" in the affairs of other countries. But it also professes to believe in international treaties and organizations and the development of nuclear weapons in Iran would violate those treaties. We'll see what happens.

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washingtonpost.com: Oil, Ideology Keep China From Joining Push Against Iran (Post, Sept. 30)

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Florida: As the second most powerful land in the world... China is rising with confidence after a short 60 years -- just like America did in the 19th century. They see every difficulty as a potential opportunity. They know the history of the Middle Kingdom.

We are the most powerful land in the world, yet we are losing confidence after over 200 years. Our politics are so polarized and poisoned we are paralyzed with indecision and inaction. We don't even know our own history -- what could be more boring?

Which nation has the best prognosis? Yet, Washington keeps being rude to Beijing. The Chinese have long, long memories. Someday the tables may be turned.

Steven Mufson: History is important, and how we see our history has a lot to do with how we see ourselves today. We interpret history through the prism of the present. Many Chinese have felt, with good reasons, that China has been mistreated many times in the past century and a half. And they feel that now is their moment.
I don't think the United States has been particularly rude to China, though. And I think the China relationship is much much deeper than ever before. In some cases that creates friction, but I also think it can produce greater understanding.

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washingtonpost.com: Photo Gallery: China Celebrates 60th Anniversary of Communist Revolution

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Alexandria, Va.: Was Taiwan part of the 60th anniversary?

Steven Mufson: I didn't notice, but President Hu Jintao did speak about the reunification of the motherland, which is China's way of saying Taiwan should once again be part of China. Relations have recently improved. The current Taiwanese leader is promoting better relations with the mainland.

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Washington, D.C.: Any idea why the Empire State building celebrated China's anniversary? Thought that was pretty bizarre.

Steven Mufson: Since I'm in Beijing I didn't see or read about that, and I'm afraid I don't know.

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Philadelphia, Pa.: China is the fastest developing economy in world history. Yet, when I see so many armaments, I think of that as wasted economic development opportunities. I don't have much hope for the current government, but are there any signs that future Chinese generations will decide they are investing too much in military and instead will start investing more on improving the quality of life for Chinese residents?

Steven Mufson: As a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP), China's military spending is still relatively modest and much smaller than ours. Much more effort is in fact going into economic development. Moreover, China has realized that its large clunky army needs to become leaner and more effective. It is spending more on technology and has been steadily reducing the size of the People's Liberation Army. of course, some people in the United States who worry about a confrontation with China do not find this reassuring because they would rather China's forces remain technologically backward.
You are right that China has huge investments it still needs to make in infrastructure, clean energy, better healthcare just to name three.

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New York, N.Y.: There was a comment in the Indian press that some officials fear most a war with China than a war with Pakistan. How do you perceive the tensions between China and India and the possibilities of these two countries actually going to war?

Steven Mufson: India and China fought in 1962 after China attacked to settle territorial disputes. And there is some residual tension. But I would say that India has much more reason to fear conflict with Pakistan. I don't think China has any interest in getting involved in conflicts with its neighbors. Economic development and domestic stability are its priorities and you never know how a foreign conflict will work out. It can always turn out to be destabilizing.

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Hainan, China: Taiwan had a float, along with Macau, Hong Kong and Hainan.

Steven Mufson: Thank you for this.

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Washington, D.C.: Ever see the film "Beijing Bicycle"? Is there really a KFC on the square?

Steven Mufson: I have seen it. Good movie. There is a KFC very near the square. And there are KFC's all over. It is very successful here in China.

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Fearful American: Does the U.S. export anything to China? Or do we send our containers over empty, waiting to be filled.

Steven Mufson: The United States exports quite a lot to China, mostly equipment, machinery, entertainment and certain high technology items. Example would be passenger planes, movies and music, or wind turbines.

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Washington, D.C.: Have there been any demonstrators? Is there any visible dissension today in Beijing?

Steven Mufson: I didn't see any and I haven't read about it anywhere else. The government had this place screwed down pretty tightly. Most people watched on TV at home. On television you see a crowded square. Those were the folks lucky or well-connected enough to get passes. The streets in most of the city were pretty quiet.
In fact, this is my first real visit here in 11 years -- I was the correspondent from 1994 to 1998 -- and I took advantage of the quiet and decent weather to take a bike ride around town this afternoon to look at the enormous number of new gargantuan office and apartment blocs that have gone up.

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Evanston, Ill.: The more China grows the more secure the CCP seems. Isn't very probable the CCP will remain in power for the next 50 years?

Steven Mufson: Predicting the future of the CCP is a tricky business. I wasn't here after the crackdown on Tiananmen Square demonstrators 1989, but a lot of smart and well-versed Sinologists predicted that the party would soon lose power. After all, the change was sweeping Eastern Europe too. But China is different. For one thing, the party's leaders look stiff and old, but the party has been surprisingly adroit about bringing economic reforms to China. Two: the CCP is very aware of the threat people pose when they organize as opposed to just criticize. So the CCP has been effective at disrupting anything that remotely looks like a politically independent organization as opposed to one under the auspices of the United Front or Civil Affairs Ministry. Third, China is a very very big place. Even if the party is weak and unpopular, it is very difficult for any other group to pick up support or organize on a national scale. So I think the CCP is going to be around for a while, but I wouldn't want to guess how long. Many people think change is more likely to come from within the party itself.

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I am a proud Chinese people: Why can not you look at the rise of China and rational then? Are you the United States strong and powerful China has changed to not allow us to do?

100 years ago, the British treat you too much, may be China's attitude towards you now, exactly the same as.

Steven Mufson: If I understand your question correctly, my answer is that In theory, I don't see why China and the United States can't coexist as two confident, advanced and prosperous nations. In practice, of course, there's some friction and misunderstanding.

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Hainan, China: Why does the rest of the world criticize China for showing a little military muscle? For a country that was recently occupied and suffered tremendous civil atrocities by occupying forces, it's something that is necessary for the national psyche. China has no real outlying vassal states, minus places like Taiwan and Macau. In contrast, I notice in the recent typhoon coverage there is a U.S. Samoa. U.S. "soil" on the island of Osaka. The French in the Caribbean. The British Virgin Islands. Why does western media so conveniently ignore the history of expansion by the western powers?

It's a shame the festivities aren't broadcast around the world, they were pretty spectacular for those who don't have access. Clips are available here: http://www.tudou.com/home/dayuebing60

Steven Mufson: Thanks for this comment. Yes, people should read more history. Of course China has had vassal states, but in its more distant past. And many Tibetans and Uighurs would argue that their areas of China are subjugated. And yes, many Americans should know more about the role U.S. governments have played in other territories and countries.

I believe people could have watched the festivities on the CCTV web site and there are still some videos posted on its English language home page.

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Madison, Wisc.: Steven, Thanks for the discussion. I think one big difference between China and the U.S. is that you don't see immigrants from around the world (skilled and otherwise) saying they want to live and work and China. At least it doesn't appear to be happening. Language difficulty is obviously a big part of this. Do you think China can be successful in the long-term without this influx of talent, which has benefited the U.S. enormously in the past two centuries?

Steven Mufson: Great question. Not only has China not benefitted from an influx of talent, but it has suffered an outflow. Think of all the Chinese who left after the revolution and now after the opening up of the country. One thing that should benefit China, however, is that many Chinese who left recently have returned. And I suspect fewer are leaving. More and more basic research and design is taking place here. And there is opportunity here.
There are very few countries that attract talent the way the United States does. Even a country like France loses a lot of computer and biotech talent to the United States.

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Alexandria, Va.: It seems to me that if the CCP disappears, then China splits into squabbling countries like the Soviet Union did. Is that really in the U.S. interest?

Steven Mufson: No I don't think it is. But I think the CCP can change and many people in China argue that it should -- whether for its own sake or for the sake of greater democracy and human rights.
For all China's successes, it faces tremendous obstacles on issues like democracy, human and legal rights, pollution, internal migration, etc. That's what makes it a good story to cover.

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Nanjing, China: When can we see open Western media competing with CCTV in China?

Steven Mufson: Not likely. The Chinese government tries its best to control information here by limiting access to print, TV or even Internet sites. But Chinese people know more about the outside world than ever before I think.

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Hainan, China: For a long time I've had the somewhat naive hope that people would share knowledge, especially about technology. What China needs is to have access to new green technologies at a reasonable price and they will implement it.

Instead the media constantly harps on China now being number one or two in most emissions of this or that, ignoring that the U.S. has been number one by a long shot for decades. Does the typical American (and I include Canadians) realize that most Chinese hang dry their laundry and take a bus to work?

So for those harping that a Chinese person shouldn't buy themselves a new car, take a look at the two sitting in your driveway. How can they afford to buy and implement state of the art technology, how many t-shirts must they sell to Walmart to pay for one Boeing 747 or a coal-tower filtration system?

I'll tell you what's fueling the military equipment manufacturing, it's the realization that the U.S., France, Russia and Israel have been using arms as money makers for decades. China is just joining the party. And yes, they will sell it to Iran, just like the British before, and before that the Americans. Right?

Steven Mufson: There's a lot of truth in what you say, I think. But I would caution you against falling into the trap of saying that just because Americans have been wasteful about energy then China should feel free to be wasteful about energy. In truth, both countries need to do more in this area. In fact, David Sandalow, a top Energy Department official, was here this week talking to Chinese officials and companies about how the countries might cooperate more on energy efficiency, electric cars and carbon capture and storage projects. It isn't clear what will come of it, but it will be one of the main subjects of conversation when President Obama comes here in November. And China does appear to be starting to set higher standards for itself in energy areas, in some cases higher than US standards. As with many issues, China will and should do this for its own interests and view positive action as caving in the outside pressure.

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Steven Mufson: I think I'm going to wrap it up now. It's a little after midnight here in Beijing. Thanks to everyone for your questions and thanks for reading the Post.

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