The 'Lost' Hour: "Three Minutes," "Live Together, Die Alone"
Thursday, October 8, 2009; 3:00 PM
Join "Lost" bloggers Liz Kelly and Jen Chaney this summer to discuss "Lost's" first and second seasons. Each week, we'll assign a few episodes to watch. Then join Liz and Jen each Thursday at 3 p.m. ET to talk about what happened and how those early shows tie in (or not) to "Lost's" looming final season.
Liz and Jen, both obsessive "Lost" fans, have been writing their weekly dueling analysis of the show since 2006. When not debating the merits of Sawyer's hotness, Liz Kelly writes the Celebritology blog and Jen Chaney acts as movies editrix and DVD columnist for washingtonpost.com. For episode analysis, discussion transcripts and more, visit washingtonpost.com's Lost Central.
Jen Chaney: Hi, guys. Sorry for the delay. Liz will be piping in only periodically due to some other deadlines she's tackling.
I'll kick off by seeking some reader participation from you all.
First: if you haven't yet, please feel free to submit your own entries to Lost: TimeSpace. We'd love all of you wonderful Lost folk to fill out the map and timeline even further.
And second: this is obviously our last season two recap. We're game to keep continuing these weekly chats until season six starts, but we want to know if you are. Would you like to continue recapping and move right on to season three?
Washington DC: Have you seen this poll? What are your thoughts?
Jen Chaney: I begin by saying SPOILER ALERT:
Liz and I both were debating exactly who might be Jacob's child. My initial thought was Desmond, for reasons I can't even entirely explain. But I could be convinced that it might be Jack or -- perhaps -- Richard.
Even though Jacob shares the same hair color and similar facial features with Juliet, I didn't think they were related and neither did Liz, because Elizabeth Mitchell won't be part of season six very much. And it would seem that Jacob's kid would certainly play a key role going forward.
A place called Vertigo: Is Jeremy Davies slated to come back for season 6? I remember at one point last season many chatters including yourselves believed that Faraday held the key to the story. To Jen, how were the U2 concerts for you? I saw both the DC and Cville shows and I think Cville was way more up for it.
Jen Chaney: To my knowledge, Jeremy Davies is not returning, at least not on a regular basis. It's possible he may appear in an episode or two because it seems to me Faraday is an important character. So he may figure in, if only briefly.
BTW, did you know that today is Jeremy Davies's birthday? Well, now you do. Happy birthday, Jeremy!
Thanks for asking about U2. I enjoyed both shows, but Charlottesville was better for me. I thought there was more energy (Bono seemed particularly pleased by the response to "Where the Streets Have No Name") and I also happened to get a spot in the inner circle, about 20 feet from center stage. So that was certainly a highlight in my U2 concert-going experiences.
Cleveland, Ohio: Do either of you monitor Lost spoiler sites? I've begun to follow a couple on Twitter, and I'm wondering if what they speculate is typically right or wrong. The usual post has photos, mentions the actors invovled in the scene, and speculates on the story.
And, no, I'm not big on surprises -- reading this stuff in no way diminishes my enjoyment of Lost.
Jen Chaney: I do to a small degree. I follow several Lost-related feeds on Twitter, but not the spoiler ones.
My relationship with Lost spoiler sites breaks down like this: I go to one. I start reading. I quickly realize I'm about to read something that might ruin my enjoyment of the show as it unfolds. On some days, curiosity gets the better of me and I forge ahead, allowing me to later say to Liz: "Nah, nah, guess what I found out about next season?"
On other days, I am tempted to forge ahead, but then I think it's a bad idea, but then I reconsider that at which point, an epic, internal battle ensues until I finally give up, click away and go back to my usual business of looking up useless crap on imdb.
To your question about whether they are right or wrong, obviously I think that depends on the site and the speculation in question. In general it seems hit or miss. I have read spoilers that totally played out as suggested, and others that were way off.
Spoiler: I went to the link for Jacob's child and was immediately presented with who the child was. Thought it was just a poll. Bummer.
Jen Chaney: Oh no! My apologies everyone. I now see what you're talking about. I completely missed that update when I initially looked at that poll.
I have to say, that person totally makes sense. But it's not as exciting as some of the other possibilities might have been,
What?!?: Jacob's child??
Jen Chaney: Well, if that spoiler is correct, that's probably not right. But that aside, I am not sure how it could be Locke if the MIB was able to infiltrate his body. Seems like Jacob would have protected his son from that sort of occurence.
Then again, I still stand by the notion that Locke saw a version of Locke in the rocking chair in Jacob's cabin even though it's pretty clear by now that that didn't hapepn.
Alexandria VA: Do you plan on coming up with a list of the X questions you want answered in the last season?
Jen Chaney: I suspect we will closer to the beginning of season six. We are hoping to do a nunber of fun polls and features as the season gets closer.
Liz and I need to have a brainstorming session sometime soon. You know, in our copious non-free time.
Lexington: I am definitely game for continuing on to continue to review the rest of the seasons. I they've technically already been "analyzed" but I think that we're all looking back on every episode in a different way after season six. For the Lost newbies, they can go to the old analysis' for real-time thoughts that you guys had, and then those who are caught up can come to this chat. This way maybe we don't have to worry about spoiler alerts and tread around them.
Anyway, the details that are in season four, especially, really tie in to season six in regards to Jacob's cabin, Hurley's connection with it, and lots of other stuff that I can't remember...I guess all the more reason to recap :)
Jen Chaney: Thanks for your thoughts, Lexington. We appreciate that.
We'll have to look at the calendar and make sure we can squeeze in the rest of the recaps in the next couple of months. But hopefully we can, especially if everyone is up for keeping this going.
Also, we still need to have Paul Scheer join us for a chat! He said he was game, we just have to schedule a time. He's a busy man, with all those damoncarltonandapolarbear antics.
For Liz: Just caught up after Celebritology. Stick with The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo, if for no other reason than the follow-up, The Girl Who Played with Fire, is much better, tighter (Lisbeth-centric). Makes me want to go to Sweden. And IKEA.
Jen Chaney: Posting this so Liz will see it.
I also borrowed "Dragon Tattoo" from the library and still haven't had a chance to read it.
Austin: Yes! Please continue. I just thought it was really good show until I ran across your snazzy dueling analysis and realized I was missing all sorts of details--who knew to freezeframe episodes and look for Easter eggs within a shot?
I think it would be cool to know if the writers sit around and say "let's mess with people" and see if anyone notices the picture of Blank on so-and-so's desk.
Jen Chaney: Another yes vote. Thanks, Austin.
You know, our heads have been buried in this for so long that we sometimes forget that people are still stumbling into this whole, wonderful "Lost" world for the first time. We are glad you are one of them.
And I have a feeling LindeCuse and co. do plant those eggs on purpose, and sometimes purposely to mess with us. That's the kind of people they are.
Libby: Not a question, but just had to say that Libby - Cynthia Watros - was on Criminal Minds last night. It made me sad to be reminded that Libby's back story on LOST will never be explained :-(
Jen Chaney: I have never, even for a millisecond, watched an episode of "Criminal Minds." So I'm glad you mentioned this, otherwise I would never have known.
I agree, watching these last few eps of season two in particular has made me sad not to know more about Libby. I hope they have the courtesy to explain it all once the series ends. That woman knows more than she lets on about the island and Hurley, dang it! And I must know why!
Woodbridge, VA: Referring back to last week's discussion about Widmore, and why he is not allowed to return to the island - I remember an episode from season 5 where Ben says something like Widmore is banished because he left the island and had a child (Penny) with an outsider (?), and that is why he can never return. It was the episode where Widmore wants Ben to kill Rousseau's infant daughter Alex.
Jen Chaney: Ah, yes, you are absolutely right. That's why he is banished.
But I think part of our confusion last week had to do with why Widmore couldn't find the island, no? I could swear at some point that good 'ol Charles said he couldn't actually find the place, not simply that he wasn't allowed to go back there. Maybe I'm making that up, but if I'm not, his inability to locate it is a separate issue.
Can one of you smart people tell me if I'm talking crazy (again)?
Vienna, VA: The Swan hatch is the center of two incidents: the original explosion and the later implosion. That mirror symmetry makes me wonder if the explosion (Jack's plan, though really I think it was Faraday's idea) was not supposed to happen, and the implosion was required to undo it. Or, more interestingly, the explosion was the course correction for the implosion.
Either way, things would be different after the implosion, but I can offer only two miniscule hints that the hatch implosion did more than just mess up radio communication and turn the sky purple. The first is the rather odd behavior of Charlie when he returns to the beach, and the second is that glance that Jack and Kate share as they are hauled off by the Others. Did they realize that they were now living in a different timeline?
Of course there was no sign of this in Season 3, but maybe what we saw was the wrong timeline. It would be wild if Season 6 showed us the "other" Season 3; one that doesn't end with Jack saying "we have to go back."
Jen Chaney: Well, I think there's additional evidence that the implosion messed up some things. As we see in season three, it rendered Locke mute initially, and it also made Desmond start having flashes. Plus, it (apparently) led to the creation of Nikki and Paolo. I'm not sure it immediately put them in a different timeline, but that's an interesting theory.
I am inclined to agree with the idea that season six will present us with some alternate version of events we have seen before. Not sure if it will be season three, though. I think it's more likely to be season one, which would bring the show full circle. And ties back in with Jack's reasoning behind the explosion plan: that preventing the plane crash would save them all from lots of pain and suffering.
But I like where you're going with those two incidents and the course correction concept.
Alexandria: We never got Libby's back story, did we? Just a couple teasers in Hurley's and Desmond's flashback stories. I don't suppose at this point we'll learn anything more about her; too bad because after rewatching these episodes, I'm now really curious.
Jen Chaney: No, as mentioned earlier, we didn't. And I agree, I also am newly curious after this rewatch.
Hey, maybe we can "demand" that the writers share the Libby backstory, sort of the way people are "demanding" to see "Paranormal Activity." LindeCuse will have to pay attention if the people say so!
RE: Widmore: Maybe he can't find the island's location because the "island" won't let him. There is a reason why each person was brought to the island. If Widmore was supposed to go back, the island would have found a way to allow him to get there. He knows Eloise Hawking, and could have gotten the information from her, but he knows he can never go back because he broke one of the island's rules.
Jen Chaney: Right, this was what confused me. Clearly he has ways to get access to it from a logistical standpoint.
But what you say sounds right. The island doesn't want him to go back. Is it because he fathered a child off the island, though, or is that just one of Ben's rules? Seems like that regulatory practice comes from a higher power, because Widmore probably would not have left just because Ben deemed it necessary.
Burke, Va.: Yes please do keep reviewing. These chats are awesome. Something has been throwing me off about last season. It seems that because Ben seemed so clueless at the end of last season we gave up on him driving certain events but it seems to me that he might be proactive than we give him credit for. Just a thought. Where's Liz? In a desert in Tunisia somewhere?
Jen Chaney: Thanks, Burke.
Liz is in an undisclosed location at the moment. Could be Tunisia, could be Tallahassee ... but wait, I've already said too much.
Re: Ben, I'm with you. I think we wrote Ben off because, by season's end, he just seemed like such a broken man. And given Ghost Alex's insistence that he follow Locke's instructions, it certainly seemed like he had no choice but to relinquish whatever power he had left.
But maybe we'll see it differently on a second go-round. One never knows.
Libby no more: In one of the ABC "official" LOST podcasts, LindeCuse said that they would not visit Libby's backstory even though the fans wanted it. They may change their minds, but usually when they state something, it holds true since they're usually so ambiguous about stuff.
Jen Chaney: Yes, I heard that podcast, too. And they do tend to stick to their guns. But that doesn't mean we couldn't try to persuade them.
Unless of course the backstory is lame. In which case, I don't want to know.
Say no to back story!: I love certain loose ends in stories... or at least the ability of authors to edit. Libby is a mystery, and really serves as motivation and an enabler to both Hurley and Desmond. Remember when JK Rowling revealed that Dumbledore was gay? SO unnecessary. And before that I had not once thought about his romantic life. Grawww.
Jen Chaney: I like loose ends, too. I hear you, and agree on the Dumbledore thing.
Still, it seems to me that the writers must have had some ideas about how Libby ended up at Santa Rosa and, possibly, if she had some connections to the island. I'm not asking for a 10-page report on every detail in her fictional life. I just want a few hints as to how she knew Hurley and whether, perhaps, she knew Widmore as well.
Please, please, please: Yes, do continue on throught season three!
While I've seen all five seasons, I've only been chatting since season 5 and I've only been watching LOST since last December (yay for DVD's!). I know I could read the archived chats, and I probably will, but still I'd love to chat about season 3 now that we know more.
Jen Chaney: Another pro-chat vote. Thanks for that.
I think it's pretty likely we'll continue, we just need to plan it out and make sure the powers that be (and by that we mean Jacob) are cool w/it.
RE: Widmore: Based on what we know, the one who made the rules of the island was Jacob (communicated via Richard). I agree there is no way Widmore would have left just because Ben told him he was banished.
Jen Chaney: Right. Or at least everyone *thinks* it was Jacob. Clearly the phone line between Ben and Jacob has crackled with more than a little static over the years.
Alexandria: The orientation film in the pearl had a copyright of 1980; this is post-Incident, yes? But Dr. Chang's arm seemed fine. Are there maybe multiple past timelines tangled up on the island somehow converging on the Oceanic crash? Or something like that? This is a very half-formed thought, but it seems as if the Swan orientation film (injured arm) and the Pearl film don't match, knowing that Dr Chang hurt his arm before the Pearl film was made.
Jen Chaney: Oh, good point about Chang/Candle's arm. I actually comprehend your half-formed thought and think it's pretty interesting.
Could some of the orientation videos have come from one timeline, and others have come from another? And if so, does this mean that Hurley and Sawyer's will no longer have a copy of "Xanadu" in their cute little Others cabin?
Widmore: So are we saying that if Widmore had been on rthe freighter the ship wouldn't have been able to find the island? If after Penny was born he had stowed away on the sub, what might have happened (short of him getting nosebleeds or something). I can respect he is physically unable to get back to the island or bad things will happen to him, hard to fathom how he couldn't find it again knowing how he got to it in the first place and him knowing hos Linus's folks came and went--he's got an awful lot of money for someone who spent his formative years on an island.
Jen Chaney: I don't know what we're saying. I think what our reader was suggesting (and what I agreed with) is that Widmore can't return to the island because it won't let him.
Not so much that he can't find the island, but that he can't physically get back there. I think I may have been remembering a scene where Widmore said he's been trying to get back for years, and thinking that he said he's been trying to find it for years. And he didn't necessarily use the word "find."
I'll try to investigate further and refresh my pathetic memory.
Beltsville, MD: The "Lost" spin-off series:
A tragicomedy about a woman so obsessed with a guy named Hugo that she checks herself into a psychiatric ward just to be near him.
Jen Chaney: Great idea! I think they should call it "Everybody Loves Libby." Or maybe "It's Libby!" Yeah, the title definitely needs an exclamation point.
Man, there really are not enough sitcoms set in mental institutions these days. This could be a TV turning point.
And on that wacky note, I'm signing off. Liz and I need to confer once she returns from Tunisia ... ahem, I mean gets finished with her other deadline ... but let's plan on reconvening here next week at 3 p.m. We'll figure out which episodes to rewatch and post them soon, since it sounds like that's what you all want.
And we believe in giving the people what they want.
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