Jen Chaney and Liz Kelly, with special guest Nikki Stafford
Washington Post "Lost" bloggers, "Finding Lost" author
Wednesday, January 6, 2010; 2:00 PM
Join "Lost" bloggers Liz Kelly and Jen Chaney at their new time, each Wednesday at 2 p.m. ET, to talk about "Lost." In addition to discussing the looming final season, the "Lost" ladies will focus each chat during the month of January on highlights from the series's run.
This week, readers should come to the discussion ready to chat about their favorite emotional moments from the show's history: the scenes that made you laugh and/or cry. Joining Liz and Jen in the nostalgia fest: special guest Nikki Stafford, author of the "Finding Lost" book series (ECW Press), which consists of complete, analytical companion guides for every episode of the show. Nikki also has written companion guides to "Buffy the Vampire Slayer," "Alias," "Angel" and "Xena: Warrior Princess," and blogs regularly on her site, Nik at Nite. She also conducted her own "Lost" rewatch.
Liz and Jen, both obsessive "Lost" fans, have been writing their weekly dueling analysis of the show since 2006. When not debating the merits of Sawyer's hotness, Liz Kelly writes the Celebritology blog and Jen Chaney acts as movies editrix and DVD columnist for washingtonpost.com. For episode analysis, discussion transcripts and more, visit washingtonpost.com's Lost Central.
Jen Chaney: Welcome to the "Lost" Hour at our new day and time: Wednesdays at 2. We're very happy to have Nikki Stafford with us today (she's the author of the Finding Lost series, by the way) to talk about our favorite emotional moments from the series so far, not to mention continue wildly speculating about season six based on information with no merit whatsoever.
So really quickly, here are two of my favorite emotional moments:
For laughs, I still crack up every time Hurley's mother hears the phone ringing and says, "Oh, that must be Jesus!"
And on the weepy side, certainly the demise of Charlie Pace, but I'd also like to call out the moment in season two when the Tailies show up on the beach and Rose finally sees that her Bernard is alive. The woman had faith, and she was right.
Nikki Stafford: Hello everyone! I have so many favourite emotional moments I wouldn't know where to start, but one of them that jumps into my head immediately combines both the funny and the poignant, and that's in "The Lie," when Hurley finally comes clean to his mother. That scene is so beautifully done, with Carmen coming to him and saying she wants to know the truth. He looks at her, and that funny loopy Hurley music begins playing as he tells her this long tale about an island and other people and stations and numbers he had to put into a computer, and for a second it looks like the scene is going to be played for laughs, but then he gets serious and says he left people behind, and they survived, and he doesn't know what to do. She reaches forward, touches his hand and says, "I believe you." For a guy who everyone thinks is crazy -- and whose number one paranoia is the worry that everyone WILL think he's crazy -- having those words said to him is so huge. I adore that moment, and pretty much every scene between Hurley and Carmen. I say they need their own spinoff show!
Liz Kelly: I'll share my favorite emotional moment a bit further into the discussion. Right now we just need to get this show on the road!
annandale, va: My favorite memory of Lost was in season four I think. Sawyer and Hurley crusing in the VW van with Shangri la on the 8 track. The song was stuck in my head for a week. That's the moment I fell back in love with Lost.
Nikki Stafford: Crap. Now that song is stuck in MY head and will be for the next week. LOL! I loved that scene, too. It was so joyful.
Liz Kelly: I believe you mean "Shambala":
Jen Chaney: Now you can have the song and the video's imagery stuck in your heads. Enjoy!
Silver Spring, MD: For me, the most emotional/poignant/touching/happy/tear-jerking moment was definitely when Desmond and Penny reunite. (I can't wait for the Jin/Sun version!)
I would also rank highly the moment at the end of the first season when Sawyer tells Jack what his father said in that bar in Australia.
Nikki Stafford: I really loved that moment, too, especially because it had been built up in such a big way -- with Des finding her note in the Dickens book, and then saying her name right before he thought he was going to die, and risking life and limb to get to the pilot in the jungle that he thought was her, and then connecting with her via phone -- and it wasn't a disappointment at all. As I mentioned in the book, I loved the way the scene was constructed, with Penny at the top of the boat (representing the fact she's upper-class and in the higher echelons of society) and Desmond at the bottom, and they both meet in the middle. Beautifully, beautifully done.
Liz Kelly: I'm with you on both moments, but totally behind your endorsement of the Sawyer/Jack moment. I think some of the show's most poignant moments tend to involve Sawyer -- maybe because it's so unexpected coming from the ne'er do well conman. Or was. After season 5 I don't think we can doubt his heart.
And so my moment is the season 5 finale ender -- when Juliet says her poignant goodbye to Sawyer as she slips from his grasp to fall down the hatch shaft. I'm getting chills just thinking about it.
Jen Chaney: I hope there is a Jin/Sun version of the Des/Penny reunion. Would be kind of a rip-off if there wasn't.
I also hope Jin gets to see Ji-Yeon, too, and watch her grow old enough to wear a bikini that he will naturally feel compelled to cover with a towel.
Nikki Stafford: Agreed, Jen. I can't wait to see that reunion! Especially with Ji Yeon. And just to get one other moment in there: seeing Sun take Ji Yeon to visit Jin's grave has me bawling like a baby every time. What a scene. For that reason alone I can't wait to see the reunion.
Austin, TX: Did someone turn a frozen donkey wheel and move you guys to Wednesday?
Jen Chaney: Someone did. Us, actually. With "Lost" moving to Tuesday nights, we wanted to start the Wednesday chat shift, so people are nice and settled in when the show gears up again on Feb. 2.
Liz Kelly: And that isn't the only new thing. Make sure to sign up to follow our new Twitter Lost feed -- WaPoLost (so original).
Wheaton, Md.: I think I read somewhere that the previews for the final season of "Lost" aren't showing any clips from what's been shot of the season because it's SO different, showing stuff would give it away. You think they're just creating hype or there's actually something to it? Thanks and love the chats!
Liz Kelly: I guess we won't really know until Feb. 2, but in a new interview at the Hollywood Reporter, LindeCuse again reiterated that the final season is closer in feeling to season 1 than anything else.
Those two really are masters of saying nothing in an interview. Kudos. There's essentially nothing new here since Jen and I talked to them last year.
Jen Chaney: They say nothing in such an entertaining way, though. It's truly a gift.
Nikki Stafford: It really is a gift. Just this morning I was saying to someone that one of the biggest things I'll miss about Lost are the Darlton interviews. Those two are brilliantly funny and know how to talk around any question and make you think they actually answered it. :)
Plano, TX: Will any of you support a LOST Themed Disney attraction, whether it be a ride (E-ticket, or course) or an attraction, or even an entire theme park? Will you sign the petition?
Nikki Stafford: Is this who I think it is? ;) I saw on Twitter yesterday that Damon signed the petition, and offered to donate the Frozen Donkey Wheel if they went ahead with it. :)
Liz Kelly: This might actually get me to make a return visit to Disney World, so I am all for it.
Jen Chaney: Plano, already signed it weeks ago. Peruse the sigs and you'll see mine in there.
Chester, NY: So many good moments, but one of my favorites is Hurley building the golf course in the first season and his rousing speech about needing to have some fun so they don't go crazy.
Nikki Stafford: That's a really interesting one to point out, because as you say, Hurley was certainly established as the show's comic relief in the first season. And now, as we enter season 6, isn't it interesting to see how much he's changed? Many of my favourite moments in the series are funny Hurley moments (I mean seriously, can you BEAT the Hot Pocket-throwing scene?!) but one that really stands out is at the beginning of season 4, when he thinks they're about to be rescued, and he does the cannonball into the ocean. What makes that scene so poignant for me is that he's the happiest we'll ever see him on the show -- they're about to be rescued, he assumes his family has spent all of his money and he'll "be free" -- and then, as soon as he surfaces, he sees Desmond's boat. Des then delivers the news that Charlie is dead and it doesn't look like they'll be rescued at all. What an incredible moment that was. So to mention the golf course definitely provides a perfect bookend to that scene to show how much he's changed!
Look Boss, Da Plane, Da Plane: Ladies...thanks for keeping us entertained during the show's hiatus.
During the last chat with Doc, Jen said something like: "...our core characters will now be leading normal lives, having landed safely at LAX.
Well may I offer an alternate reality/reset theory?
The bomb goes off in 1977 and resets everybody's lives. All the Losties still end up on flight 815 from Sydney to LA but instead of crashing on the island and some of them surviving, they all die in a fiery crash as the plane approaches LAX (theory based partially on one of the Season 6 promos).
What say you?
Nikki Stafford: I know this is the "fave moments" chat, but hey, I love speculating. Rarely out loud, since I'm almost always wrong. ;) But the big question of S6 will be whether or not they'll go for a do-over. My thinking is there will be one for the first episode or so, only to show us some sort of 'what if' scenario? But I just don't see them taking 5 years of character build-up and throwing it out the window. They're far too smart for that.
What Team Darlton is really good at is changing the game, and between coming up with the flashforwards and then the time jumping last season, they've shown they know how to turn things around without losing anything we've gained so far. So I'm confident they're going to come at us with a whopper of an idea.
Jen Chaney: I think Nikki has a good point; we may see them leading normal or altered off-island lives initially, as I postulated.
But it seems like they have to revisit so many character and narrative issues that have built up during the last five seasons that all of S6 couldn't be a reboot in the truest sense of the word.
But I do think the lives of our Losties as we knew them will be different, at least initially. And perhaps by the end of S6, they will be back where they started once again.
Liz Kelly: I'm with Jen and Nikki here. As LindeCuse said in the interview linked elsewhere in this chat, they were most concerned with closing the circle for each character in season six -- in having each character's story fully told and resolved.
So does that mean we should expect more poignant moments and less three-toed statues? That's my hunch, at least for now. I, of course, reserve the right to flip-flop at a later date. Or to reboot, so to speak, my thinking on this issue.
A working man.: A quick question : The promos for the new season have Charlie saying " where the heck are we ? " ( not quoting exactly ) and I'm wondering is that just some stuff from season one or is Charlie coming back ? Also I've noticed you all seem to place a lot of burdens on us chatters ( " be reeady to discuss this or that..." or read Catch-22 or whatever... ) and I just want you to know I'm doing my best but I do have other things that I need to get done and always expecting us to be prepared for these chats is a bit much.
Jen Chaney: I think Charlie may come back, but everything you're seeing promos footage-wise is from previous seasons. They haven't released any scenes from the new season yet, per the previously mentioned secrecy.
And as far as chat preparations, I don't think "tell us about a favorite scene" puts nearly as much of a burden on you as "Read 'A Brief History of Time.'" We also welcome questions that are Lost-related but not necessarily related to the theme of the week's chat. So please, don't feel like you need to study or something.
These discussions are supposed to be fun. We don't want you to feel like you have homework. I mean, that's what Lost University is for.
Nikki Stafford: However (plug! plug!) my books all contain chapters catching you up on all of the books mentioned on the show (I think the chapter for Brief History of Time is 8 pages long) and it's a great way to do the background research without having to do the background research. End plug.
Washington, DC: Who is coming back from the dead or missing? Obviously Claire needs to return to resolve that plot, but what about Boone and Claire? Charlie? (please no!)
Liz Kelly: Oh Claire is totally back as you can see from the recently released "Lost" supper promo art.
Speaking of which, lots of theories surrounding that picture -- is Claire glaring at Kate? Why does Kate have Claire's peanut butter? Why is Sawyer leaning on Kate? Are Hurley and Sayid marked for death? Does Richard Alpert have wrinkles?
Are we reading too much into it?
Jen Chaney: That was a rhetorical question, right? When do we ever *not* read too much into "Lost"?
Kate also has a knife in her hand, I think. Which I'm pretty she means to use on Liz for constantly criticizing her in these discussions. At least that's what I heard.
To answer your question, I believe both Boone and Charlie will return, at least briefly.
Chester, NY: My fav emotional moment was when Sawyer sees Kate in the jungle during the flashy-time- warps. Ah, his face.
My favorite lol moment is when Sawyer, Juliet, etc. are in the boat and there's people shooting at them and it starts to flash and Sawyer says "thank you Lord" and then it's downpouring and he says: "I take it back." I laughed so loud.
Jen Chaney: Holloway did play that scene -- the one where he sees Kate delivering Claire's baby -- very nicely.
This also reminded me of another moment that made me laugh: when Hurley tried to convince Sawyer to watch "Xanadu." Any show that can reference both "Xanadu" and "Back to the Future" obviously has its head on straight.
Liz Kelly: The "Xanadu" moment was a definite winner -- and, at the time, a nice bit of comic relief from way too much information being thrown our way. That's part of the genius of the "Lost" writing -- tempering the mindbending aspects of the show with hip humor and lots of pop cultural touchstones.
Which reminds me of another moment -- Hurley's surreptitious attempt to write the "Empire Strikes Back" script last season.
Dallas: My two favorite emotional moments were both from season finales: Charlie's sacrifice in "Through the Looking Glass," and Juliet slipping away from Sawyer in "The Incident."
Nikki Stafford: Both of these moments left me gutted. I cry EVERY TIME I watch the Charlie death scene. It wasn't just the loss of Charlie (which, granted is huge) but the way the scene was set up. The way it's switches to slow-motion, and then the quiet violin music plays and you don't actually hear any of the noise in the scene... oh man, I'm tearing up just thinking about it.
And yes, Juliet falling down the shaft left my breathless last season. It was the opposite of Charlie's death -- loud, frightening (where his was quiet and peaceful), and SUCH a shock because I certainly didn't see that coming. I'm still upset about it. :(
Liz Kelly: Interesting how none of our most emotional moments (thus far) involve that harpie Kate.
Nikki Stafford: Ack! Kate hate! OK, just to rush to her defence for a second (don't hate me, Liz!) the single saddest moment in the show for me is when Kate leaves Aaron behind in the hotel room in "Whatever Happened, Happened." I remember being SO upset after watching that, it took me a long time to get over it. Mostly because Aaron could be my son's twin, and I just couldn't imagine having to go through what she did.
Jen Chaney: Nikki, I'm so with you. And weirdly, I am pretty sure I said almost the exact thing in a blog post or chat right after that episode. It got to me because my son also looks a lot like Aaron. Although, truthfully, looks are somewhat beside the point. Having to abandon a child is a wrenching thing to do. Don't even like to think about it.
Arlington: I second Jen's weepy moments and throw in the scene where Desmond and Penny reunite on her boat. I bawled like a baby. I just LOVE those crazy kids!!
Liz Kelly: Or how about the moment when we find out that Des and Penny have named their wee bairn "Charlie."
Jen Chaney: The Charlie reveal was more like a mini-verklempt moment (a verklempt-let?) for me. Des said it so quickly that you only had time to absorb and say "Aww" for a second.
Nikki Stafford: And it didn't help that that adorable little pup looked exactly like what I picture a young Charlie looking like. :::sniffle:::
FB, Toronto: Hi Nikki! I'm a big fan. :) I was wondering, whom do you think the Adam & Eve skeletons will turn out to be (if we even get that question answered at all!)?
Nikki Stafford: Hi FB! This is DEFINITELY one of my favourite questions, and I love chatting about this with everyone (and referring to that Last Supper photo of the cast that there are two skulls on the ground, which could very well be Adam and Eve). If you remember back to the beginning of the series, Jack found the caves and there were two bodies in there, whom Locke referred to as the island's own Adam and Eve. One of them had a pouch around its neck with two stones, one black and one white.
I like the idea that it might be Aaron and Ji Yeon, the one who was born on the island and lived, and the one who was conceived on the island and lived, and the time traveling somehow put them there even though they died far off in the future. I've heard Jack and Kate (Jack says one of them is a woman, one is a man) which would be eerily awesome, given that Jack and Kate would have then been staring at their own dead bodies. There's also the possibility of Jacob and the Man in Black, the original bodies they sloughed off before becoming... whatever they are now, but that would be two men and wouldn't work out. And one of my favourites is Bernard and Rose, which would be kind of lovely, I think.
boston MA: BIG fan of Nikki's FINDING LOST series and of her Nik At Nite blog ... Q. Will you feel satisfied at the conclusion of the show if many of the mysterious are left unresolved, inviting endless speculation in the years to come?
Nikki Stafford: Thank you for saying that! And yes yes yes. I have some big ones I want answered, as do we all, but I would love for some things to be open-ended and leave us speculating and discussing things for years to come.
Jen Chaney: How's this for a wishy-washy answer: I will be satisfied if all the crucial mysteries are resolved, but a few minor ones are not.
Ohio: So, I was thinking: As this final season progresses, will there be less and less to discuss in forums like this? I mean, presumably many things will begin to sort themselves out/be answered, so I wonder if a point will come when we say: "Ok, I see where we're heading now. Let's enjoy this ride. No need for more guessing and theorizing."
Or maybe the tone of the discussions will change to something like "wow, what did you think of that?" as opposed to "wow, what the hell does that mean for the future of these characters/endgame?"
Nikki Stafford: Great question. I don't think there will ever be an end to the Lost discussion. I mean, people are still arguing the finer points of Star Trek's original series, so Lost is sure to have people talking for a long time. If you consider the vast number of unanswered questions right now, there's no way they'll all be answered by the end of S6, so a lot of the speculatory discussion will continue.
However, I think there will also be a lot of academic/scholarly discussion on Lost the way there has been on shows like Buffy the Vampire Slayer, which offers an academic conference for scholars every two years. Lost, in its completed form, will be like any piece of literature that you studied in university. Just as Ulysses was a finished product filled with cultural, historical, philosophical, and literary references, so too is Lost, and scholars will be discussing the finer points of the series for many, many, many years to come.
Jen Chaney: Well said, Nikki.
For the less scholarly, more casual fan, I think that you're right, Ohio. The discussion will start to shift from "What do you think will happen next?" to "Can you believe THAT'S how they resolved that storyline?" and "Are you telling me the Smoke Monster is actually Frogurt"?
By the way, if the Smoke Monster really does turn out to be Frogurt, everyone reading this discussion must pay me $35.
Canada!: What is one unresolved issue on Lost that really bugs and you think will not be answered? For me, it is Libby.
Love, Patchy the Canadian
Liz Kelly: Hi Patchy -- are you related to McPatchy, perchance?
I'm a bit concerned about the Walt storyline. Obviously they can't bring back the now 17-year-old Malcolm David Kelly to play him, but so much of season 2 revolved around the Others's interest in him and his seemingly special qualities. It'd be a shame to see that left as an unraveled string.
Jen Chaney: Both Libby and Walt are high on my list.
I also hope that we get more clarity about Jacob's identity, specifically who or what was in that rocking chair during "Man Behind the Curtain." I feel more confident that we'll get answers on that than I do about the other two.
Nikki Stafford: Wait, you're from Canada? Then you MUST be evil, and we cannot trust your questions. (And, as a Canadian, I welcome you into our fold of evil.)
I think I'd have to agree with Jen and Liz. After rewatching the series again in light of the S5 finale, I think maybe the Walt storyline *might* be OK left as is (he's a kid who was special, and therefore the Others took him, leading his father across the island, causing mayhem everywhere, and then he got out of control so the Others got him to leave, and now he lives in Manhattan and his dad is dead, and his final bit was to give his prophetic dream to Locke, telling him he saw people standing around him being angry and wanting to hurt him on the beach) BUT certain elements of it could be answered. Like, how was he appearing to Shannon and why? How did Taller Ghost Walt appear to Locke?
I think Libby is definitely the highest on my list. I've believed from the moment we saw her in the hospital with Hurley that she's somehow connected to a group that got everyone to the island. I would LOVE to see more of that, despite them saying Cynthia Watros won't be returning (do you believe them? I don't.)
Arlington, Va.: OK--since someone beat me to the Des/Penny reunion weep-fest, let me nominate any conversation between Hurley and Miles as being absolutely hilarious. Especially the one where Miles was trying to explain to Hurley Daniel's time travel theory.
Nikki Stafford: Those two are brilliant together. It's like they realized back in season 1/2 that Hurley was really good with Charlie, and now they needed another guy to pair him with, and it turned out to be Miles. Miles is just so angry and caustic, he's the polar opposite of Hurley and so brilliant. That scene is awesome, especially Miles pulling out the gun and saying, "Here. Shoot me. Please?" What about the scene where they're in the car and Miles figures out he's rewriting Empire? Or Miles' face when Hurley is caught by Chang and can't answer any questions about the Korean War. BRILLIANT.
Liz Kelly: Another good pair: Hurley and Sawyer. Jen already mentioned the "Xanadu" moment... and the thought of those two as roommates is just such an "Odd Couple" pairing. But I also love the storyline -- I think it was in season 3 -- where Hurley tricks Sawyer into believing he has to lobby the Losties to like him and, after roundly trouncing Sawyer at pingpong, imposes the no-nicknames ruling.
Jen Chaney: That whole no nicknames thing was straight out of a Moonlighting episode. But I loved it anyway.
Mclean, Va.: I'm really excited about the anticipated parallel's between Season 6 and Season 1. The selection of February 2 has to be deliberate, right? (A reference to Bill Murray's brilliant "Groundhog Day").
Jen Chaney: I had the same thought. It's either deliberate or a happy coincidence that the "Lost" writers are particularly relishing.
Hurley Times: For me the saddest moments have always been scenes with Hurley. First time was when Libby is dying and Hurley is crying and goes "I'm sorry I forgot the blankets." Second one is when he has to tell Claire that Charlie died. I get hysterical every time I see those, it just breaks my heart every time Hurley is upset.
On happier notes, my roommate and I are planning to watch the premieres and finales to refresh before the premiere. Any other episode suggestions?
Jen Chaney: Oh, agreed. Every time Hurley makes that speech ("Charlie was my friend. So I'm listening to my friend") I tear up.
As far as other ep. suggestions, I think it's a good idea to watch as much of season five as you can, just to refresh that memory about what just transpired and put it into context.
Portland, Ore.: It didn't make me laugh or cry, but it did make me jump off my couch and yell "Why?!!" - when Michael shot Ana and Libby. Also Shannon getting killed was a little sad, mostly because they had spent the whole episode making her seem like less of a spoiled brat.
Again, not a laugh or cry, but a "Yay!" moment when Hurley drove the van into the camp and took out several Others.
Nikki Stafford: That moment made me scream, literally. Hands in the air, scream, and then when he shot Libby, I screamed louder and just sat there, stunned. Until that moment I don't think I'd ever been shocked that much by something on TV, at least not two things in such quick succession. What a brilliant moment.
east leafy, ma: This may sound a bit sadistic, but given all the punishment Ben Linus has meted out over the timeline of the show, I have to say that it was very rewarding to see Jack pummel him senseless at the end of Season 3!
Jen Chaney: No, I think most viewers were with you there.
By contrast, seeing Ben deflated by the end of S5 was just sad.
Nikki Stafford: I couldn't agree more, Jen. Watching him first have to deal with the death of Alex (I made a quick list of my favourite moments, and that was near the top of it) as he sat by her body, and then becoming so enraged he went off the island and turned into some homicidal Quentin Crisp in a black fedora, and then to just be reduced to a weak follower (when Jacob said, "What ABOUT you?" I was devastated for him) was just shocking. There's so much about Ben I sympathize with, and I just have never been able to conjure up any hatred for the little weasel. Maybe it's because Michael Emerson is such a genius.
Jen Chaney: Wait a second. Just hold up
Do we have a second person in this chat who also finds Ben an empathetic character?
It's two against one now, Kelly!
Liz Kelly: Just one second, Chaney. You know I don't hate Ben. I've just always been of the opinion that he is essentially a bad guy, whilst you have always contended that he is a good guy who has used bad means to attain his ends. In my book, bad = bad, no matter the intentions.
The guy killed the remnants of the entire Dharma Initiviative -- including children -- in cold blood. How is that defensible?
Jen Chaney: I never said it was defensible. All I am saying is that in his mind, it was for the greater good. Was he right about that? Probably not.
At one time I thought what he did might actually prove to be more obviously, genuinely for the greater good. I don't know about that, but I maintain that Ben believed he was doing what Jacob and the island wanted, and that justified his behavior in his mind.
Nikki Stafford: Ooh, the "is Ben good or bad" discussion? I have this one on my blog all the time, and with every episode I seem to change my mind (but even when he's bad, I love him). I remember the first time I saw the final scene in "The Shape of Things to Come," where Ben comes to see Widmore (still what I consider to be the absolute centerpiece of the entire series, and the scene that turned EVERYTHING... I could write an entire book on that scene). At first I saw Ben in the shadows, dressed in black, and Widmore in white, bathed in light. But then I watched it the other way and you realize Widmore is in white, but half of his face is shadowed, and similarly, half of Ben's face is in the light. So they're very smart in making it possibly going either way.
I actually think Ben DOES think he's doing the right thing, but... you know... the same way Hitler thought he was doing the right thing. ;) It's moments like when Jack says in "316," "But what about the rest of the people on the plane?" and Ben looks at him and says, incredulously, "Who cares?!" D'oh.
Jen Chaney: Not to belabor this, but one could also accuse Sayid of being a cold-blooded killer with little regard for human life.
The thing is we like Sayid, and we feel like we understand his moral compass somewhat, so we give it a pass. But with Ben, uh-uh. He has weird, buggy eyes and he's always lying about everything, so he can't go around murdering people on top of all that. It's too much!
But murder is murder, even if you're kinda hot and know awesome neck-snapping breakdance moves.
Favorite moment: So I'm on a re-watch right now (just started Season 4) and you guys have hit on a lot of my favs/poignant moments (Charlie's death, Penny and Desmond etc.)
Mine is maybe a bit odd but that moment at the end of Season 3 when we realize that we're watching a flash-forward instead of a flash back. It was awesome in a change up the storytelling way. Same thing with the whole Locke in the box...in my re-watch thing I keep trying to figure out if Locke "died" earlier and that he guy masquerading as him was inhabiting his body much earlier than we ever knew.
Jen Chaney: The flash-forward was a major moment for sure. I'm sure we'll touch on it again as we cover memorable moments of other kinds in upcoming chats.
We've debated that Locke question a lot. I am leaning toward no, that he wasn't possessed until he died and came back to the island.
Liz Kelly: I'm with Jen. I don't think Locke was actually possessed by the MIB until after his off-island death. But, as we know, the MIB may have had a hand in influencing Locke and pushing him onto the path that led to his death.
(Remember MIB Locke encouraging Richard Alpert to take his compass to the time traveling Locke?)
Nikki Stafford: During the rewatch I conducted on my blog (which will finish in two weeks), part of what we were doing in the beginning was looking for clues that John Locke was already possessed somehow. Not because we thought he was, but just as an exercise (we were also looking for clues that Libby might be an Other, for example). And there are lots of clues, but they could just be coincidences of things we're looking for. What is NOT a coincidence is how many times we've seen Locke flat on his back, splayed the same way he was when he fell out of the building.
It's an idea that I posited back in the summer to my readers: what if Locke really did die when he fell out of the building, and when Jacob touched him, he put the Man in Black inside him? Then when Locke's eyes opened and he looked around wildly, it's because he was in a new (broken) body. Jacob says, "I'm sorry this happened to you" and he could have been talking to the MiB.
Of course, I was throwing this out there in fun, and to be honest, I don't think that's the case (I actually hope it's not the case) because I think the story of John Locke has been one of the central things of the entire series, and to realize that the trials and tribulations of John Locke were actually not really happening to him? Nah... I'd hate that.
Colesville, MD: Weepy moments? Anything Korean. Jin and Sun have the most poignant scenes. In the first season when they become estranged after Jin learns that Sun knows English and then he admits that the reason he is going on the raft is because he knows he has failed her and he needs to save her... Crying at my desk.
Liz Kelly: That's a good point. The Korean scenes really resonate because of the amount of communicating that both Yunjin Kim and Daniel Dae Kim are able to do with just their eyes and body language. Sure we've got subtitles, but those two are masters of telegraphing their love or their distress with just a look or a touch.
Nikki Stafford: Or what about Sun's reaction when she sees the freighter blow. Ugh. I felt like I'd been punched in the gut watching her incredible performance in that scene.
Jen Chaney: "Crying at my desk" -- love it.
That must go over well at the office.
"Are you crying? Is everything okay?"
"Yeah, I'm fine." Sniff, sniff. "Just struggling a little with this spreadsheet."
"Oh well, if you need help ... wait, are you watching 'Lost'??"
Little Help?, DC: Can you guys help me remember what the heck happened to all of the other survivors who weren't the Oceanic Six and didn't end up in the Dharma Initiative? Was everyone else killed in that fire arrow attack? Are they stuck in the past or the present? Maybe I haven't been watching closely enough, but even after just finishing Season 5 (I started the series over the summer) I still feel like I am missing something.
Nikki Stafford: Everyone is dead (except for Walt, who is in NY). We saw all of the main people die, and then the only ones we didn't see die were either the Oceanic 6 and Desmond and Frank, or Locke, or Sawyer's group wandering around aimlessly (and Bernard and Rose, who were having their own little party somewhere else). The fire arrow attack takes out most of the background characters, and anyone who survived that was taken out at the river when that one redshirt stepped on the landmine. Bye bye, extras.
Jen Chaney: What she said.
Adam & Eve: Nikki & Paolo. Heh, heh.
Liz Kelly: Not a bad theory, actually -- but that would mean someone had at some point dug their bodies up from the beach and moved them to the cave. Also, I don't believe the Eve skeleton was wearing a bikini top.
Nikki Stafford: Actually, can I just use this opportunity to say that the death of Nikki and Paulo is one of my all-time highlight moments of the series? I LOVED that episode (and during the rewatch I couldn't wait to write about it some more). I'd imagined every possible death scenario for them, but what the writers came up with was far more evil. BWAAAHAHA!
Smokey Frogurt: You've seen me UNDER the Temple ... but even I don't know what goes on INSIDE the Temple. What do you think?
Liz Kelly: Isn't that where they hold the weekly "Survivor" votes?
Jen Chaney: I think that it would be amazing if Smoky/Frogurt could set up a new soft-serve stand in the temple. That way, when you go down there to confront the ghost of your dead daughter or what have you, you can get a nice chocolate/vanilla swirl at the same time.
Nikki Stafford: HAHA! Only if he served it up ominously... "Two ice creams, two sides. One light, one dark. Now swirled together for your pleasure."
Chester, NY: One of the greatest emotional moments for me was Sayid's reunion with Nadia, especially with the knowledge that they would have such a short time together before she was killed.
Also, in reference to my earlier comment about Hurley, it was a fun moment, but it also set him up as one of the people who could consistently see what people really needed. He really cared about the people and that continues on. In S5 he goes back because he really wants to help the people who were left behind. He has no ulterior motive like so many of the others, he is going out of the goodness of his heart.
Nikki Stafford: Oh, thank you for mentioning this one!! I have to sit here waiting for people to mention my favourite moments and then jump in. I'm SO happy you said this one, because it's beautiful, and the way it was told -- with us already knowing she died AND seeing her funeral entourage BEFORE we see their reunion -- set it up as a bittersweet, ultimately tragic moment. For me, it's the way actor Naveen Andrews reacts in the scene that just makes it for me. The way he steps outside, stands there, says feebly, "Nadia?" like he doesn't believe his own eyes, reaches for her, and then blinks, hard, as if he STILL doesn't believe his own eyes. Just PERFECT.
Funny moments: I just love all the moments with Sawyer in that cage - hilarious!
Jen Chaney: Personally, I bawled the first time he successfully ate a fish biscuit.
Wenham, Mass.: Shout out to all the Nik At Nite readers participating in today's chat! A lot has been speculated upon as to LOST's legacy as a TV series in the years to come. We've seen some pale imitations pop up (FlashForward, etc.) What are the chances that another breakout show could take advantage of LOST's unique narrative style to draw in fans - even with a completely different kind of backdrop?
Nikki Stafford: I've just been catching up on Fringe, and I think it's the closest thing to Lost right now in terms of storytelling, of keeping aside certain parts of the story (rather than flashforwards and flashbacks, it's more of a flash...sideways, to not spoil anything) and only telling you a bit at a time. I'd highly recommend that show to Lost fans.
Jen Chaney: I have been meaning to watch Fringe and still plan to.
That said, I'm not sure we'll see something entirely like Lost in the near future. Maybe narratively, but in the way that the show has capitalized and engaged fans online ... I mean, what other show could start its own university on a Blu-ray disc and actually get people to participate?
I also think networks are a little worried about signing on for shows like "Lost." The budget on it is extraordinary, and it obviously requires immense time commitment. But I hope we see some series that do carry on its legacy.
Georgetown, DC: Most of the chatters mentioned Sawyer and Juliet, Jin and Sun, Penny and Desmond, but one of my fave heart wrenchers was the secret love (haha) of Daniel Faraday and curly red haired Charlotte. And before her death Charlotte remembers that she has been on the island before and there used to be this crazy man who told her never to come back and that was... DANIEL. (WHAT! WHO SAW THAT COMING!) And after she dies in the forest, Daniel later meets little Charlotte on the swing set as the Dharma families are being evacuated from the island and he has a little talk with her never to come back. Tears streaming down my face! AMAZING. SO AMAZING!
Nikki Stafford: Ugh, you guys are killin' me here. All of this sadness! But yes, when he first sees Charlotte the first thing the little girl says to him is, "I'm not allowed to have chocolate before dinner" and then, rewatching the series, when those are the final words she says to him (as if the final thought in her head was the first thing she said to Daniel), I was just heartbroken. SO beautifully done.
Jen Chaney: I also think Jeremy Davies brought such a gentleness to Faraday that it made his tenderness for Charlotte very believable and real. Lots of good love stories on this show, more than in three years' worth of crappy Hollywood romantic comedies, I think.
Derwood, MD: Favorite scene: When Penny and Des connect via the radio on the freighter. The way the scene was shot, how it was cut, and the joy in their voices, was just awesome.
Nikki Stafford: I particularly loved, as you say, how it was edited, with Penny saying part of the sentence, and then Desmond finishing, and her continuing, and then him picking it up... it just showed how connected they were in such a quick, short amount of time. Definitely one of the top highlights of season 4.
Centreville: Two of my favorite moments were when Rose saved the candy bar for Bernard and then when they were reunited. The only thing that would have made if perfect was if they had shown her giving him the candy bar.
Nikki Stafford: When those two were reunited, I remember tears streaming down my face and I was more excited about that reunion than the simultaneous one between Jin and Sun. I love those two.
Ben Linus: I have to say that, even though it may not be a major plot point, if we end the series with no explanation of what happened to Annie, I will be pretty disappointed.
Jen Chaney: Oh, that's a good one! I also would like to know more about her role. She's clearly important to Ben, since he hung on to that doll for so long.
Nikki Stafford: Oh, absolutely. The Annie thing must be mentioned again, no question.
Washington, D.C.: "Lost" is pretty much set on the Great Isle of Daddy Issues, isn't it? Controlling dads, dead dads, divorcing dads, con-man dads, shameful dads, abusive alcoholic dads. It's a cornucopia.
Jen Chaney: See, I prefer to think of it as a potpourri.
Actually, it's interesting to consider why that is. Why are fathers so central in all of this? Jacob, in a way, is a father figure as well. Which might be a good reason, given the dad history you mention, not to readily trust him either.
Wenham, Mass.: Almost too many favorite moments to mention - BUT one that still fills me with delight is the first glimpse we get of the giant statue on the Island. -chills-
Nikki Stafford: That was one of those moments where we all went, "AAAAAAHHHHHHH.... uh... oh." and poof, it was gone. What a thrill that was! They definitely left us wanting more that time!
Jen Chaney: Thanks so much for joining us today. We'll be back again next Wednesday at 2, hopefully with another special guest. And we'll again focus on a specific category of show highlights, as well as whatever new fodder about the show has bubbled up on the blogosphere.
Nikki, thanks to you for being here and bringing your very smart insights into the discussion.
Nikki Stafford: Thanks so much for having me! It was a blast. Enjoy the season 6 premiere, everyone!!
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