U.S. vs. Microsoft
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Deposition of Bill Gates
August 28, 1998, Part A, Page 4

On Wednesday, April 28, 1999, the official transcript of the
deposition of Microsoft Chairman Bill Gates was released.

	1			MR. BOIES:  Okay.  I'll try to do it.  
	2		Q.	Actually, I think probably the word
	3	"content providers" was not used, but the word
	4	"content" was used by the witness and I think it was
	5	used in the context of answering the question.
	6			THE WITNESS:  If you're actually
	7	interested, it's the "use IE" where you seem to be
	8	confused about what content providers do.  There is
	9	no question about what content provider means.  When
10	you say "use IE," it's people who view content who
11	use IE.
12		Q.	BY MR. BOIES:  Right.  And in order for
13	somebody to view content through IE, that content has
14	to be put someplace to begin with; right?
15		A.	Yes.
16		Q.	And one of the things that Microsoft
17	has tried to do is it has tried to convince content
18	providers to put content places and in a way so that
19	it was more attractive to view that content using IE
20	than with Netscape's browser; correct, sir?
21		A.	It's not the places that make it
22	attractive.  It's the way they use the HTML.
23		Q.	What you've tried to do, what Microsoft
24	has tried to do, is get content providers to display
25	information in a way that would make it more
	1	attractive to a user to view that content using IE
	2	than using Netscape Navigator; correct, sir?
	3		A.	No.  We tried to get them to author it
	4	in a way that they exploit our HTML extensions. 
	5	Author.
	6		Q.	And is the effect of that to make it
	7	more attractive for users to view the content using
	8	IE than Netscape Navigator?
	9		A.	It totally depends on what they do --
10	what Netscape Navigator does with HTML extensions and
11	what that content provider does with those HTML
12	extensions.
13		Q.	Let me ask what I think is a simple
14	question.  Has Microsoft made an effort to get
15	content providers to agree to display information in
16	a way that makes that information more attractive
17	when viewed by the then existing Internet Explorer
18	than if viewed by the then existing Netscape browser?
19		A.	Our efforts have been focused in
20	getting them to author so that it looks good in
21	Internet Explorer.  These people are authors.  They
22	don't do display, they do authoring.
23		Q.	Let me try to use your words and maybe
24	that will move it along.  
25			Have you tried -- has Microsoft tried
	1	to get content providers to agree to, in your words,
	2	author information and data in a way so that that
	3	information and data is more attractive to users when
	4	viewed through the then current version of Internet
	5	Explorer than when viewed through the then current
	6	version of Netscape's browser?
	7		A.	Our attempts to convince people to
	8	author using our extensions is not relative to
	9	Netscape.  It's just a question of can we convince
10	them to use our extensions.  And yes, we have
11	endeavored to convince them to use our extensions,
12	but that doesn't say anything about what they're
13	doing or how that stuff looks in Netscape.
14		Q.	Are you saying that your effort to
15	convince content providers to use your extensions was
16	unrelated to what the effect would be on Netscape?
17		A.	The effect on Netscape would be
18	indirect.  Our intent in doing that was to increase
19	the popularity of our products.
20		Q.	Was part of your objective also to
21	decrease the popularity of Netscape products?
22		A.	Our intent was to increase the
23	popularity of our products.
24		Q.	I'm asking a different question.  The
25	answer may be simply no, but I'd like to have an
	1	answer to my question, which is that in addition to
	2	trying, as you say you were trying to, to increase
	3	the popularity of your products, were you also trying
	4	to decrease the popularity of Netscape products?
	5		A.	All of our effort was aimed at making
	6	our product more popular.  There may have been an
	7	indirect effort in terms of their people choosing our
	8	product over other people's products, but the focus
	9	is on making our product more attractive.
10		Q.	Did you enter into agreements with
11	content providers that limited the ability of those
12	content providers to make their content more
13	attractive when viewed through Netscape's then
14	current browser?
15		A.	I'm not familiar with agreements that
16	we had with content providers.
17		Q.	You're not familiar with them at all;
18	is that what you're saying?
19		A.	I know that we had some, so I'm
20	familiar with their existence.  I've never read one,
21	I've never seen one, I've never negotiated one.
22		Q.	Have you ever discussed with anyone the
23	substance of what is in them?
24		A.	What I know about them is that they --
25	they're related to the efforts to convince people to
	1	take advantage of extensions we've done that make
	2	those extensions worthwhile to end users.
	3		Q.	My question now is whether you've ever
	4	discussed the substance of what's in those agreements
	5	with anyone.  And if you have --
	6		A.	To the degree I just described them,
	7	yes.  Beyond that, no.
	8		Q.	With whom did you have those
	9	discussions?
10		A.	Oh, it would have been in meetings with
11	various people.  You know, Brad Chase, Paul Maritz. 
12	Brad Silverberg in a certain period of time.
13		Q.	And did they ever tell you that these
14	agreements with content providers limited what the
15	content providers could do with Netscape?
16		A.	I don't think so.
17		Q.	Do you know, as you sit here now,
18	whether any of the agreements that you entered into,
19	Microsoft entered into with content providers over
20	the last three years limited what those content
21	providers could do with Netscape?  
22			MR. HEINER:  This question now is,
23	perhaps intentionally, quite a bit broader than the
24	original question about extensions and so forth?  Or
25	maybe it's not intentional.
	1			MR. BOIES:  It is a different question.
	2	And if the witness doesn't understand it, I'll
	3	rephrase it.  
	4			THE WITNESS:  I know that when I was
	5	going to testify in Washington, D.C. in the Senate,
	6	that Netscape or someone was raising these content
	7	provider agreements in an effort to create some
	8	controversy around them.  And so I was given like a
	9	paragraph or two summary.  And there were about 40
10	issues in general there, but one of the issues was
11	related to those agreements.  And so there may have
12	been something in those paragraphs about the
13	agreements beyond what I knew about them earlier.
14		Q.	BY MR. BOIES:  But you don't recall the
15	substance of that now; is that what you're saying?
16		A.	Well, I can tell you there was
17	something about in a period of time a certain class
18	who is on our channel bar, they could appear on
19	competitive channel bars, but if they -- they could
20	only pay us.  There was something like that.
21		Q.	That's an interesting one for you to
22	focus on.  Can you think of any reason why you would
23	want content providers to agree that they would not
24	pay Netscape any money?
25		A.	I know that we had hopes that the
	1	channel bar would get some usage and we wanted to
	2	work with some content providers to show off the
	3	channel bar.  And I can't give you the reasoning
	4	behind any part of the ICP agreement because I wasn't
	5	involved in those.
	6	       Q.	But what I'm asking you now is whether
	7	you, as you sit here now, can think of any legitimate
	8	reason why Microsoft would be getting content
	9	providers to agree not to pay Netscape?  I'm not
10	talking about getting them to try to use your channel
11	bar.  I'm talking about getting them to agree not to
12	pay Netscape.  
13	       A.	You'd have to ask somebody else why
14	they put that in the agreement, unless you're asking
15	me to speculate wildly.
16	       Q.	Well, I don't know whether it would be
17	wild speculation or not, but I'm asking you whether
18	you, as you sit here now, as the chief executive of
19	Microsoft, can think of any legitimate reason for
20	Microsoft getting content providers to agree not to
21	pay Netscape?  
22		MR. HEINER:  Object to the question as
23	lacking foundation.
24		THE WITNESS:  I'm not aware of any
25	broad prohibition against paying Netscape for
	1	anything.  I think there was something about relative
	2	to the channel bar, we wanted some of the premier
	3	partners, which is a very small number, to talk about
	4	their work with us.  And it would have been
	5	embarrassing if all those same people were in the
	6	same relationship with Netscape in that time period.
	7		Q.	In your answer in which you said that
	8	you thought you recalled some of the things that you
	9	were told in preparation for your hearing testimony,
10	you were the one, were you not, just a few minutes
11	ago who said that you recalled that there was some
12	provision that even if the content provider was on
13	another channel bar, they couldn't pay for it?  Do
14	you recall saying that just a few minutes ago?
15		A.	Uh-huh.
16		Q.	You've got to say yes so the 
17	reporter --
18		A.	Yes.
19		Q.	Now, that's what I'm asking about. 
20	What I'm asking is whether you can think of any
21	legitimate reason why Microsoft would get a content
22	provider to agree not to pay Netscape?
23		A.	I can guess about that if you want.
24		Q.	What I'm asking is not whether you can
25	guess why you did it because we could all guess maybe
	1	why you did it.  What I'm asking is whether you can
	2	think of any legitimate reason that would justify
	3	doing that?
	4		A.	Sure.
	5		Q.	What?
	6		A.	Well, someone might have said, gee, it
	7	would be embarrassing if all these same people
	8	appeared in Netscape's equivalent in that time
	9	period, let's have them agree not to appear at all. 
10	And then someone else might have said no, let's not
11	be that restrictive, let's just make it less likely
12	they will appear by saying that they won't pay
13	Netscape to appear.
14		Q.	But if you're going to let them appear,
15	why would you try to stop them from paying to appear?
16		A.	It lowers the probability that they
17	will appear.
18		Q.	And why does it do that, sir?
19		A.	Because there's lots and lots of
20	content providers.  And so in the channel bar, these
21	gold or premier or platinum -- I forget the
22	terminology -- slots, there's only visually, at least
23	in the way we did it, room for about five or six of
24	those.  And so if you have a contract that says that
25	they won't take money from Netscpae to appear on
	1	their channel bar, given the broad universe of
	2	content providers that are out there, it's very
	3	likely that Netscape will choose to pick people who
	4	do pay them to be in their channel bar and therefore
	5	you've lowered the probability that all the people
	6	who appear in yours also appear in Netscape's.
	7	       Q.     So that precluding people from paying
	8	was an indirect way of trying to make sure that they
	9	didn't appear on Netscape's channel bar; is that
10	right?
11	       A.     No.  Now you've changed things.  I've
12	told you I don't know why the provision was put in
13	there.  You asked me if I could think of any set of
14	reasoning behind it, and which I did, and then you
15	changed and asked me a question about the history,
16	which again, I can't talk to you about the history.
17	       Q.     And I don't mean to be asking just
18	about the history.  What I mean to be asking is
19	whether you, as the chief executive officer at
20	Microsoft -- and you testified yesterday about some
21	practices that you thought were consistent and some
22	practices that you thought were inconsistent with
23	company policy.  And is it consistent with company
24	policy, let me approach it this way, to get companies
25	like content providers to agree not to pay
	1	competitors, is that consistent with company policy
	2	if that was done?
	3			MR. HEINER:  Objection.
	4			THE WITNESS:  Well, our company policy
	5	is that when we're doing agreements, we rely on the
	6	expertise of our law and corporate affairs department
	7	to look at those and make sure that they're
	8	appropriate.  That's one of the things that's done in
	9	agreements like that.
10		Q.	BY MR. BOIES:  Well, other than
11	whatever your lawyers tell you that you can do, which
12	I don't want to ask about because I think they will
13	probably object that it's privileged, do you have a
14	company policy that addresses the issue of whether it
15	is appropriate for Microsoft people to enter into
16	agreements that limit companies from doing business
17	with Microsoft's competitors?
18		A.	There is no general policy that covers
19	that area.  As I said, the very competent staff we
20	have is involved in reviewing agreements we reach.
21		Q.	Did you ever have any conversations
22	with anyone about whether or not they could deal with
23	a competitor of Microsoft?
24		A.	That's open ended enough that I'm not
25	sure what you mean at all.
	1		Q.	I mean to keep it open ended as an
	2	initial question and then if you say no, I don't have
	3	to go through it, but if you say yes, then I go
	4	through who you met with and what you said.  
	5			MR. HEINER:  Let's have the open-ended
	6	question read back, if we could.
	7			(The record was read as follows:  
	8		"Q.  Did you ever have any conversations with
	9		anyone about whether or not they could deal
10		with a competitor of Microsoft?") 
11			THE WITNESS:  I'd say the answer is
12	probably yes because, for example --
13		Q.	BY MR. BOIES:  If the answer is yes,
14	then --
15		A.	No, I want to make -- I think I should
16	give an example so you understand how I've
17	interpreted your question.
18		Q.	Could you give me a specific example?
19		A.	Yes.  IBM is a competitor of ours and
20	people have said to me should we fly out and meet
21	with IBM on this topic.  And I've said in some cases
22	yes, we should and in some cases no, we shouldn't. 
23	So that's a case where I was giving people advice on
24	whether they should deal with a competitor of
25	Microsoft.
	1		Q.	Were these people within Microsoft?
	2		A.	People -- yes.
	3		Q.	Now, have you ever had any personal
	4	conversations with anyone other than a Microsoft
	5	employee as to whether that person's company could or
	6	should deal with a competitor of Microsoft?
	7		A.	Well, in terms of should, I might have
	8	said to somebody that --
	9		Q.	No, no.  I'm not asking what you might
10	have said.  What I'm asking is what you remember
11	doing.  I'm trying to move this along.  I'm trying to
12	stay as concrete as I can and I'm not asking you to
13	speculate about what you might have done.  
14		A.	Okay.  I know --
15		Q.	I'm asking you what you remember doing.  
16		A.	I know concrete cases where I've told
17	customers that I think picking our product as opposed
18	to a competitor's product is in their best interests
19	and so they should pick our product.  And in that
20	sense, yes.
21		Q.	Have you told people that if they pick
22	your product, they can't use a competitor's product?
23		A.	If there's a technical issue about how
24	things won't work together, possibly.  But otherwise,
25	no.
	1		Q.	Do you know a Mr. Poole who works at
	2	Intuit?
	3		A.	No.
	4		Q.	You do not?  
	5		A.	No.  I think you're confused.
	6		Q.	You may be right, but all I need to do
	7	is get your testimony down and then people can judge
	8	for themselves.  
	9			So it is your testimony that you do not
10	know anyone who works at Intuit who is named
11	Mr. Poole.  Do you know somebody at Microsoft who
12	deals with Intuit who is named Mr. Poole?
13		A.	Yes.  It's quite distinct.
14		Q.	Yes.  The distinction actually is at
15	the heart of what I'm going at, sir.  
16			What is Mr. Poole's first name?
17		A.	Will.  That's at least what he goes by.
18		Q.	And what has Mr. -- what is Mr. Will
19	Poole's title?
20		A.	I have no idea.
21		Q.	You have dealt directly and personally
22	with Mr. Poole, have you not, sir?
23		A.	Not until very recently.
24		Q.	When was the first time that you dealt
25	directly and personally with Mr. Poole?
	1		A.	Well, if you mean was he ever on an
	2	e-mail that I went back and forth on, that probably
	3	goes back -- that could be any time in the last few
	4	years.  In terms of actually being in a meeting that
	5	Will was in, I think that's quite recent.
	6		Q.	When?
	7		A.	Which?  
	8		Q.	Both.
	9		A.	I said in terms of e-mail, that would
10	be the last couple years.  How can I be more concrete
11	than that?  I answered the question.
12		Q.	Can you be more concrete than the last
13	couple years?
14		A.	No.
15		Q.	Okay.  Now, when with respect to the
16	meeting?
17		A.	I don't think I was in a meeting that
18	he was in until maybe two or three months ago.
19		Q.	Did you ever have a discussion with
20	Mr. Poole, either orally or through an e-mail, in
21	which you told Mr. Poole what the conditions were
22	pursuant to which Microsoft would give Intuit access
23	to a position on the Active Desktop?
24		A.	There may have been mail on that
25	general topic, but I don't remember any specific
	1	mail.  
	2		Q.	Did you have any discussions with
	3	Mr. Poole, apart from e-mail?
	4		A.	No.
	5		Q.	Did you tell Mr. Poole in words or in
	6	substance that Intuit could get access to a position
	7	on the Active Desktop only if it would agree not to
	8	deal with Netscape?
	9		A.	There may have been some discussion
10	about whose browser technology Intuit chooses to 
11	integrate its products with.  There certainly wasn't
12	anything broadly about dealing with Netscape.
13		Q.	Let me try to be as precise as I can. 
14	Did you tell Mr. Poole in words or in substance that
15	if Intuit wanted to have access to a position on the
16	Active Desktop, Intuit would have to agree to use
17	Microsoft's browser technology and not use Netscape's
18	browser technology?
19		A.	I don't remember that specifically, but
20	I do know that we were, in various time periods,
21	endeavoring to get Intuit to choose the component
22	ties to IE technology as the way that Quicken -- the
23	default way that Quicken would bring up a browser. 
24	In fact, they've always supported both browsers at
25	all times.
	1		Q.	My question to you is whether you told
	2	Mr. Poole either orally or through e-mail that in
	3	order for Intuit to get access to a position on the
	4	Active Desktop, Intuit would have to agree not to use
	5	the Netscape browser technology?  Did you tell
	6	Mr. Poole that orally or through e-mail?
	7		A.	I know we were talking with Intuit
	8	about using IE as the default browser because of our
	9	technology.  So in that sense of being a default, we
10	were trying to get them to favor IE.  But I don't
11	remember any specific thing beyond that.
12		Q.	So is it your testimony that you do not
13	remember telling Mr. Poole in words or in substance
14	that if Intuit was to have access to a position on
15	the Active Desktop, Intuit would have to agree not to
16	use the Netscape browser technology?
17		A.	Intuit has supported the Netscape
18	browser technology at all times and I never thought
19	there was any chance of avoiding them supporting the
20	Netscape browser technology.  I did think there was a
21	chance that we would become the default and I was
22	hoping we could convince them that it made sense for
23	them to make us the default.
24		Q.	Default browser?
25		A.	That's right.
	1		Q.	I understand that's what you said and I
	2	do want to explore that, but I want to first be clear
	3	that it is your testimony that you never told -- or
	4	at least you don't recall ever telling Mr. Poole in
	5	words or in substance that in order to get access to
	6	a position on the Active Desktop, Intuit would have
	7	to agree not to deal with Netscape or not to use the
	8	Netscape browser technology?
	9		A.	I don't remember using those exact
10	words.
11		Q.	How about substance?
12		A.	In terms of substance, my desire to get
13	us to be the default did imply a favorable position
14	for us relative to other browsers.
15		Q.	Is it fair to say that your position
16	with respect to wanting to become the default browser
17	for Intuit meant that the Microsoft browser would
18	have a more favorable position, but it would not
19	preclude Intuit from dealing with Netscape; is that
20	correct?
21		A.	That's right.
22		Q.	Now, I want to follow up on that issue,
23	but before I do, I want to be absolutely certain that
24	I have your testimony now clear.  And that is,
25	leaving aside the issue of becoming the default
	1	browser, did you ever tell Mr. Poole in words or in
	2	substance that in order for Intuit to have access to
	3	a position on the Active Desktop, Intuit would have
	4	to agree not to deal with Netscape or not to use the
	5	Netscape browser technology?  Did you ever
	6	communicate that to Mr. Poole in words or in
	7	substance?  
	8		A.	You can't leave out the idea of the
	9	default browser.  It's nonsensical to say did you do
10	that but leaving out the notion of the default
11	browser.  The substance of us being the default
12	browser is that that's a favorable position for our
13	browser.  So what you've just asked me is
14	nonsensical.
15		Q.	Does making Internet Explorer the
16	default browser preclude Intuit from dealing with
17	Netscape?
18		A.	In a specific way, yes.
19		Q.	In what way?
20		A.	Any deal that relates to them being the
21	default browser.
22		Q.	Other than a deal that involves them
23	becoming the default browser, does it preclude Intuit
24	from dealing with Netscape?
25		A.	Not necessarily.
	1		Q.	So that Intuit could make Internet
	2	Explorer its default browser but still deal with
	3	Netscape with respect to Netscape's browser, correct?
	4		A.	Intuit at all times has supported the
	5	Netscape browser.
	6		Q.	Now, I think it has to be clear from
	7	what you just said that it is your view that becoming
	8	the default browser does not preclude Intuit from
	9	dealing with Netscape completely in terms of
10	browsers; is that fair?
11		A.	Well, it was the issue that would have
12	been of the most interest to us.
13		Q.	I'm not asking what the interest was
14	that you had or what the issue was that was of most
15	interest to you.  What I'm asking is whether, aside
16	from the issue of the default browser, have you ever
17	told Mr. Poole in words or in substance that in order
18	for Intuit to get access to a position on the Active
19	Desktop, Intuit would have to agree not to deal with
20	Netscape or not to use the Netscape browser
21	technology at all?
22		A.	That question doesn't make sense to me. 
23	If you say that somebody is not the default, you're
24	certainly affecting how they deal with you on the
25	browser.
	1		Q.	Would you explain what you mean by
	2	that?
	3		A.	We wanted to convince Intuit to make us
	4	the default browser.
	5		Q.	And making you the default browser,
	6	does that preclude them from dealing with Netscape at
	7	all in terms of browsers?
	8		A.	Not in every respect, no.
	9		Q.	Okay, not in every respect.  
10			Did you ever tell Mr. Poole in words or
11	in substance that if Intuit was going to obtain
12	access to a position on the Active Desktop, Intuit
13	would have to stop supporting the Netscape browser?
14		A.	Well, supporting can mean a lot of
15	different things.  I know that --
16		Q.	I mean what you mean when you said it.  
17		A.	I never expected at any time that they
18	would not support the Netscape browser in terms of
19	running with it, working with it, supporting it and
20	all those things.  In terms of did I use that
21	specific word, no, I don't -- I don't have a
22	recollection.  But, you know, support can mean quite
23	a few things.
24		Q.	What I'm not doing right now is asking
25	what you meant by support.  What I'm asking you is
	1	whether you told Mr. Poole that.  Do you understand
	2	the distinction?
	3		A.	Did I use those words?  
	4		Q.	That you told Mr. Poole --
	5		A.	See, if you're going to ask me did I
	6	use the exact words, you can ask me that question. 
	7	Or if you're going to ask me if I said something like
	8	that, that's okay, but then I have to actually
	9	understand what the words -- what you mean by the
10	words.
11		Q.	Let's take it one step at a time.  
12			Did you tell Mr. Poole that if Intuit
13	was to have access to a position on the Active
14	Desktop, Intuit would have to stop "supporting" or
15	could no longer "support" the Netscape browser?
16		A.	What does it mean when you keep going
17	in and out of quotes like that?  
18		Q.	It means you used the word "supporting"
19	or you used the word "support."  
20			MR. HEINER:  In that case, you should
21	put the document in front of the witness.
22			MR. BOIES:  I'm just asking whether he
23	ever communicated that orally or in writing or by
24	e-mail to Mr. Poole.  
25			MR. HEINER:  I think you twice
	1	testified in the scope of your questions about things
	2	he said.  And so if you have a document, at some
	3	point, just put it --
	4			MR. BOIES:  I'm just asking him whether
	5	he said it.  
	6			THE WITNESS:  Whether I said what?
	7		Q.	BY MR. BOIES:  Well, whether you told
	8	Mr. Poole that if Intuit was to have a position on
	9	the Active Desktop, that Intuit would have to agree
10	to stop supporting or could no longer support, that
11	is, you used the word "support," the Netscape
12	browser?  Did you do that, sir, in e-mail
13	communications or orally or any other form of
14	communications to Mr. Poole?
15		A.	I don't remember using those words, if
16	that's the question.
17		Q.	Do you remember whether or not you used
18	those words?
19		A.	No.
20		Q.	Let me turn now to the substance of
21	what you told Mr. Poole.  And what I'd like you to
22	describe for me in your own words is what did you
23	tell Mr. Poole, either orally or by any other form of
24	communication, Intuit would have to agree to in order
25	to get access to a position on the Active Desktop?  
	1			MR. HEINER:  Objection.  I may be
	2	mistaken, but I think the question lacks foundation.
	3			MR. BOIES:  I will rephrase the
	4	question.
	5		Q.	What, if anything, did you tell
	6	Mr. Poole --
	7		A.	I'm not sure if I told Mr. Poole or
	8	Mr. Chase or Todd Nielson or who, but I'm sure I
	9	communicated that the kind of support Intuit had been
10	giving where Netscape was the default browser, that I
11	didn't see that as consistent with agreeing with 
12	them -- for them to be featured on the active channel
13	bar.
14		Q.	I think that goes to what you were
15	saying before, which is that you wanted Microsoft's
16	browser to become the default browser?
17		A.	That's right.
18		Q.	Now, what I'm trying to do is ask
19	whether you went beyond that in talking to Mr. Poole. 
20	Did you say to Mr. Poole that if Intuit is going to
21	get access to a position on the Active Desktop,
22	Intuit had to do something more than simply make IE
23	the default browser?
24		A.	That was my goal there, which of course
25	would imply a change in how they'd been supporting
	1	Netscape as the default browser.
	2		Q.	I understand that you said you wanted
	3	IE to be the default browser and that inevitably
	4	means that Netscape can't be the default browser
	5	because you can only have one default browser; right?
	6		A.	Right.
	7		Q.	What I'm now asking is did you go 
	8	beyond that and say to Mr. Poole that if Intuit was
	9	going to get access to a position on the Active
10	Desktop, Intuit would have to do something more than
11	simply make IE the default browser?
12		A.	I don't think so.
13		Q.	Did you ever say that to Mr. Chase or
14	to anyone else?
15		A.	I don't think so.
16		Q.	Or communicate it in e-mail or some
17	other communication?
18		A.	I included that.  So no, I don't think
19	so.
20		Q.	I thought you might have included it,
21	but I wasn't sure, so I wanted to be clear.  
22			MR. HEINER:  If we've come to a logical
23	stopping point within this small subset of this
24	point, let's break for lunch.
25			MR. BOIES:  Okay.  
	1		MR. HEINER:  Okay.  
	2		VIDEOTAPE OPERATOR:  The time is 11:54. 
	3   We're going off the record.  
	4		     (Lunch recess.)
	5		          * * *
	9		I hereby declare, under penalty of
10	perjury, that the foregoing answers are true
11	and correct to the best of my knowledge and
12	belief.
13		EXECUTED AT_____________, WASHINGTON, 
14	this_________day of________________, 1998.  
16		     ________________________________
17		              BILL GATES
		Released Pursuant to 15 U.S.C. 30

Continued on Part B, Page 1.

Copyright 1999 The Washington Post Company

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