Amy Joyce Craig Cola

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Life at Work Live PREMIERE
Hosted by Amy Joyce
Washington Post columnist
Tuesday, Jan. 22, 2002; 11 a.m. EDT/EST

Do you experience the many joys and frustrations of working life that many of us do? Talk to Washington Post columnist Amy Joyce and her experts about how to deal with them. Amy hosts weekly online talks for working folks who want talk about interpersonal issues in the workplace.

Join Amy and host, Don Marshall live on streaming video on February 12th at 11 a.m. ET.

The transcript follows below.

Editor's Note: Washingtonpost.com moderators retain editorial control over Live Online discussions and choose the most relevant questions for guests and hosts; guests and hosts can decline to answer questions.

Washington, D.C.: I am currently in the development field working with a non-profit here in the District. Although my coworkers are nice, the job is not exactly what I expected. There is no independence, they want to have 2-3hr meetings about everything. I've been here for 6 weeks. Complicating things further, I was laid off in July 2001 and didn't start working at my current job until Dec 2001. What would I say on an interview? Will I be able to even get an interview? How do I address this on my resume? Am I forced to be here for a year?

Amy Joyce: If you want to leave, don't follow these unwritten rules that you have to stay somewhere for a year. Not so. However, by the time you find a new job, you may have been at this one for almost a year. Start looking now, because in today's economy, it's going to take a while. I would suggest you stay in your job while you're looking for one, if you can. I'll let Robbie discuss the resume issue.

Robbie Kaplan: You need to account for this position on your resume. Prepare an update that include some pertinent information on this current position. Write a short, introductory statement that indicates your primary responsibility. I would try to include another sentence of information but if you can't, work with what you've got. Good luck!

Bethesda, Md.: Hi Amy

Loved your column about finding a career that you love.

For me, I don't think that there is a job out there for me that I could possibly enjoy. I envy my father who has had the same job for 25 years and loves it just as much now as he did on the first day on the job.

So I'm a mercenary. Unless I suddenly became a super athlete, I don't think that there's any job that would transcend the desire for each paycheck. I only work for the money. Do you think that mercenaries like me should just make as much money as quickly as possible and retire?

Amy Joyce: There has to be something you like to do. Think long, think hard. Say you were able to retire tomorrow. What would you do with your days? That thing that you really look forward to doing... try to figure out how to turn that into a career. Robbie, what suggestions do you have for someone who wants to find a job they want to do?

Robbie Kaplan: I would sit down and chronicle your ideal day. What would you be doing, what would you be wearing, where you be doing it and with whom? Visualize what would make you happy and write it all down. Everyone should be able to identify what experiences, skills, abilities, and interests give them pleasure. There are so many ways to earn a living and you need to explore options that match your desires. Good luck!

Amy Joyce: Robbie, so many people are struggling in the job they are in right now. They want to break out and find something they really like to do. How possible is that right now? Should people even take a shot at looking for a new job in this economy?
How picky can they be, and what sort of job search pointers do you have for them right now?

Robbie Kaplan: I truly believe in the career planning process. You have just one life to live and it may as well be the best it can be. Despite the economy, begin to identify your career interests, you likes, dislikes, skills, and abilities. Truly immerse yourself in career literature. Network and talk to anyone that can help you fine-tune your career interests. Once you have a goal in mind, determine what qualifications you have and what credentials you need. Begin to acquire them and position yourself for jobs of interest. It is so important that you enjoy your work. There will always be shifts in the job market so begin now!

Washington D.C.: What would you do if you found out your immediate supervisor and your assistant were involved in a personal relationship?

Amy Joyce: Tough call, and tough situation. What would I do? I'd probably scream and start toning up my resume. But that's just me. You're probably feeling like you have to not give your assistant too much work, you can't criticize him/her. I'll be writing a column on this topic in the next few weeks. Thing is, it's a bad situation, no two ways around it. Your boss is being very unprofessional, and should do something about it, or should not have let it happen in the first place. I know, too late. You might want to think about looking for something else, some other position, or even asking your immediate supervisor what the heck he/she is thinking. Ask how possible it would be to mix up the personnel a bit, maybe move your assistant to someone who isn't supervised by this person's boy/girlfriend. Ick. Anyone out there have some advice? Similar situation?

Robbie Kaplan: This is a tough situation. I would think through my options very carefully before making a decision.

Arlington, Va.: I was wondering what do you do when you feel that your work interferes with your life? That is, that you can't go certain places or associate with certain people because of how it would look or conversely, if you can't control how you live your life, should you give up on your job? Thanks in advance.

Amy Joyce: I'm not sure what kind of job would keep you from living your life outside of work. Doesn't sound like a good situation to me. But are you sure it's your job that keeps you from being you, or is it you?

Robbie Kaplan: We all sacrifice at different points in any career to make progress. We often call it paying your dues. You alone need to determine if you are paying too high a price. Carefully assess where you want to go and what steps to follow to get there. This should help you decide how this current position fits into your overall plans and goals. Good luck.

Washington D.C.: I only have about 2 and half years experience, and at the same company. Although while I've been here, I've accomplished a lot. And been promoted twice. How do I make my resume reflect my skills and show that I'm ready for managerial or more responsibility kind of job? Not another grunt job? How do I make my resume say that I'm not just a kid with two years experience but someone who has grown substantially and has gained a lot of experience?

Robbie Kaplan: Words are powerful tools in communicating your experience and your accomplishments. It is important that resumes reflect not just the scope, depth, and breadth of what you do but what you accomplish and contribute - and in some cases, despite what circumstances. My new book, "How to Say It In Your Job Search" details how to word and present your credentials in the most favorable light - and how to downplay too. Good luck!

Career change: Could you recommend any good books, web sites, etc that outline the career changing process? Often times I find books that ask you to write down your ideal typical day, etc. but that doesn't easily translate into a job, or they recommend jobs that are not for professionals. I feel that I need to expand my career horizon beyond finance, IT and government and see what else is out there. Any recommendations of how to do so?

Robbie Kaplan: You need to read occupational literature. Try the Occupational Outlook Handbook to identify different job/occupational clusters. Use that as the springboard to identify other written sources and links to professional associations, journals, and books. There is so much out there and you need to find jobs that spark your interest. Question everyone you meet about their jobs and organizations. Career transitions are made on informed decisions. You need to be savvy in researching options. Try a college career center for extensive materials. Consider occupational testing that will point you in specific directions. Always research - career transitions take time and careful exploration and planning.

Rockville, Md.: I am finding out through many a grapevine that I am none too liked at my job by my co-workers. I have been aware of this, but never really had confirmation until recently. They've been talking about me behind my back and are said to be anxious for me to leave. Why? I have no idea. Personally, I don't care. I am not at work to make friends, but what can I do to just make my work relationships tolerable?

Amy Joyce: Again, a tough situation. But perhaps you need to listen to why these folks don't like you. Maybe there is some constructive criticism in there that you can heed. Robbie, when people are in interpersonal situations that are unpleasant, like this one, or the one where the boss is dating the assistant, how do employees figure out when it's time to leave? And what explanation do they give to potential employers who might ask why they want to move on?

Robbie Kaplan: There are layers of issues here - the first one you need to address is your interpersonal relationships at work. While it is true you are not at work to make personal friendships, it is crucial that you get along with your co-workers. Successful workers are team players and independent performers. We all need each other to do the best job possible in the workplace. It may be time for some self-evaluation and a new attitude at work. It may be possible to improve relationships in your current job. If you can't or choose to leave to make a fresh start, you will have to establish work relationships as a priority to ensure a more successful experience in the new organization. It is so important that you work collaboratively in any work assignment. Good luck in working this out!

Washington, D.C.: I find myself very busy at work, but also very bored. I hope that it will get better, but I'm not sure how to break myself out of these doldrums. Is there any way to distinguish if this is just general ennui, or if it's time to think about doing something else? I really like my co-workers, I've been promoted 2x in 2 years, and I seem to be ok at the job. I just can't muster up much enthusiasm about it and I'm annoyed all the time!

Amy Joyce: This does happen. If you feel like you've hit a bump in the career road, I'd suggest asking for new and more interesting work at your company now. And it certainly doesn't hurt to look around a bit. Check out some networking events, talk to friends in industries that interest you. Though sometimes we cause our own boredom by not taking on new projects, or coming up with new and interesting things to do at our own workplace, which you sound to enjoy other than the work itself.

Robbie Kaplan: You can also volunteer to take on a new responsibility that may interest and energize you.

Bethesda, Md.: Hey, guys, I'm the "mercenary" who wrote to you earlier. You asked what I'd do if I was retired. Well, I'd probably travel a lot, go play golf, ski, and play on the beach and so on. The thing is, the things I want to do don't pay the bills -- when was the last time someone got paid to hang out at the beach all day long or to ski all day long?

Don't get me wrong, I like my job, I just know that I'm doing it for the paycheck alone.

Amy Joyce: Yeah, don't we all just want to golf, ski, and play on the beach? What about taking a survey of friends and family, asking what they could see you doing with your future? Sometimes the ones who know you best actually do know you best and will suggest something that you hadn't thought of. I don't know what your background or skills include, but there are sports marketing jobs, event planning, etc., that could fit your interests. Robbie? Any advice for the mercenary?

Robbie Kaplan: Sometimes it can be enjoyable to work in the environment that is so appealing. Can your occupation be done in a resort, vacation destination, or sports facility? Some of the happiest workers are those that took the time to put themselves in an environment that they truly enjoy.

Rockville: Where can I find your article on finding a career you love? Both me and my best friend need this BADLY!

Amy Joyce: Check out Jobs. The Career Track column should be archived there.

Robbie Kaplan: Good luck!

RE: boss sleeping with assistant: ICK! How awkward! Maybe this is something HR should be brought in on? Or would that make the situation worse?

Try talking to COPE, they're an HR group that you can contact without the problem of them getting involved. They are there purely for advisory purposes as opposed to your company's HR department which might have to interfere because of company policy or whatever and then just make it worse insofar as your relationship with your boss AND assistant.

Amy Joyce: Don't know a thing about COPE, but going to post this anyway. It's a very tough situations because once you get HR involved, things will likely get pretty sticky for you.

Robbie Kaplan: I agree.

Fairfax, Va.: Ok, another "hate my job" question BUT, what I want to do is write Children's Stories. My ideal day would be to do that from my home and be my own boss - sort of. I'm in the IT industry and make great $$ but I HATE going to work. I've written one book and so far, no takers. I've learned unless you know someone in the business you won't get any business. Any ideas on how to get in the door and make it happen? All my friends who've read the book say its really good! Thanks.

Amy Joyce: Sounds like you might need to find a book agent that specializes in children's books. Also, check out some local writing programs, like at the Bethesda writing center. There are some seminars, workshops there, and you may find ways to get published. Robbie?

Robbie Kaplan: Breaking into the writing business takes lots of patience, perseverance, and persistence. There are lots of books on the subject. Try Literary Marketplace for potential agents. Follow any and all advice. Many people are rejected repeatedly until they score a hit. Writers must have thick skins! If this is your passion, stick with it. Just understand it is not an easy road but if it is a dream, go for it!

Herndon, Va.: On Friday I faxed my resume and a cover letter in response to a job posting on company's web site. They also posted an e-mail address as a way to contact them. Would it be appropriate to send a follow up e-mail confirming receipt of my resume and reiterating my desire to talk to someone regarding the position? When would it be appropriate to send such an e-mail?

Robbie Kaplan: You certainly can send a follow up e-mail. If you just mailed it on Friday, given the holiday yesterday, they may just be reviewing the resumes today. Wait another two days to follow up and make it brief.

Washington D.C.: Hi

I absolutely loathe my boss. We had some problems a few months ago, that were her fault by the way and she was reprimanded by HR and now everything is supposedly hunky-dory. She's sickeningly sweet to me, it's so fake it makes me want to puke. I know that she doesn't care about me at all and doesn't have the slightest interest in my career development, she's just acting it out for HR and her boss. I know that as soon as she gets the chance she'll make my life hell again. Because I know she blames me for her bad managerial skills and thinks that I got her in trouble. She's taking no accountability for anything. Never has. But I need this job. I need it to get to the next step in my career. I like my coworkers but I hate her. I hate her. And I can't forgive her for what she put me through those few months. And I can never trust her again. What should I do about this? I've been gaining a lot of popularity points with my coworkers and other departments. Which I think gives me more leverage and I'm working on cross-departmental projects, which I also think, helps me out. Hopefully if anything happens I can jump to another department? Any advice for me in this political MINEFIELD?

Amy Joyce: Yikes, D.C. That's not a fun situation. Robbie, how can people not only look for a job outside of their company, but how do they walk around the political minefield and go for a different job (or a different BOSS) in the same company, preferably without making political matters worse for themselves? Similarly, how does one interview for a new job with people they already know?

Robbie Kaplan: It can be really difficult and very unpleasant to work in situations where the office staff does not get along or where individuals deliberately sabotage your work efforts. I think it is important first to assess your motivations and how you work with your co-workers and other organization personnel. You can always make a decision that this is not the type of organization or environment you thrive in. It is important to remember that it is more difficult to find a job when he workplace and economy is in such flux. Sometimes we can make things better at work just by a change in our attitude and the way we deal with and work with people. If you can't make it in your organization or another position in another division is not possible, you need to evaluate whether to stick it out or make a change. Each one of us is truly in charge of our career destiny and these choices are so personal. Take some time to think through your work situation, steps you can implement to improve, and options to resolve. Good luck!

WDC: I think I know what my ideal job is (although I need to do a little bit more research to make sure), but my problem is how to enter into the field. For the most part, getting into the field requires starting at the entry level. But I've been out of school for four years, and my level is beyond entry. While I'm certainly willing to take a step back responsibility-wise to get where I want to be, I don't know how well I could sustain the 25% pay decrease (or more) that this would involve. Moreover, I'm having trouble determining whether getting a master's in the field would put me at the right place (no direct experience in the field, but equivalent education), or if it would make me someone with too high salary expectations, too little direct experience, AND too much education--thus even a worse match than I am now. What to do, particularly on the salary issue (I might be able to work through the master's issue by talking to the right people). I can take a cut, but not that big.

Amy Joyce: You really do have to decide between salary and happiness here. And you're not going to know how much of a cut you have to take until you interview. It might not be as bad as you think. You also can just hope for a quick slide up the salary and promotion scale. Being that you're out of school for four years will likely get you moved up faster than someone with no work experience. You can ask about career development and pace of promotions in your interviews. In the meantime, think about what you can cut back on to be able to afford a decent life with a job you love. I think it's worth it, but that's up to you.

Robbie Kaplan: It's really important to be happy but crucial to look before you leap. Network, network, network! Talk to as many people as you can in the career field or industry to get some advice. The best career decisions are informed decisions. Preparation will ease the transition. I can't imagine doing work that doesn't make me happy - it is so important to enjoy your work!

Washington D.C.: My employer has recently moved offices, from a dingy basement-level sprawling office to a top-floor, sunlit, large room. My main problem is that when we left the old place, all employees except "upper-management" traded in their offices for cubicles. I find myself having trouble adapting to cubicle life: unwillingly listening to other people's phone calls and knowing that they are listening to mine, the shouting across the large room of cubicles for people's attention, and the general demeaning of being forced from an office to a 7 x 7 holding pen.
Do you have any tips on how I, and my company, can survive this drastic change?

Amy Joyce: Cube life is a world all of its own. You need to get used to overhearing conversations people are having, probably many of which are very personal (Honey, I didn't mean to call you fat!)...and you might not get used to it at all. But cubicles are a very prominent part of today's workplace. Did your company do anything to help you all out? Put some rules in place? Sometimes, it just takes time to get used to the cube deal. I'm not sure what you can do other than stick it out, try to make your space your own, and hope that you are put in your holding pen with people you like. Do things that might help drown your cube-mates out. I know one person who wears ear plugs because her neighbor is so loud. Others just keep their telephone headsets on all day, whether they're on the phone or not, and some people listen to music on their headsets. And be happy that you're in a sunlit room. I guess.

Robbie Kaplan: Amy's suggestions make sense. Do the best you can to adjust and work with your co-workers - they must be feeling the same as you. See if you can't work together. If you can't make a go of it, explore your options.

Washington, D.C.: After working in secretarial/administrative jobs for about five years after college, I obtained my first "professional" position about six months ago. My work is interesting, challenging and uses my educational background and skills. The problem is that the very long hours I am required to put in are affecting my relationships outside of work and my general mental well being. I have been told that work must always come first, and have had to cancel personal plans and days off numerous times, even when such plans have been cleared with my supervisor weeks in advance. I'm not, and have never been, the type of person who wants to dart out the door at 5 p.m., but working until 9 or 10 most nights and working through all holidays and weekends is becoming quite tiresome.

This really isn't a case of becoming more efficient; many of the projects I am assigned come up at the last minute, and I am instructed to work late or work through the weekend to get them done to meet my deadlines. When I've expressed a concern to my supervisor about these long hours and the fact that I'm already getting burnt out, I've been told I am free to go back to being a secretary if I don't want to put in the time.

Is it possible to have an interesting and challenging job that doesn't require me to sacrifice all semblance of a personal life? Thanks for your advice!

Amy Joyce: Yes, it certainly is possible to have an interesting and challenging job without giving up a good balance between life and work. It may be time (already) to start looking around for a new job. Sounds like your boss isn't going to listen to you very much right now, or concern himself with your needs. Keep at it, you're gaining good experience, and start looking for a job that will still be interesting for you, but one that allows some balance... which you NEED.

Robbie Kaplan: There are times in our careers when we need to focus a great deal of energy to gain experience and acquire skills. Sometimes things are out of balance but again, it is paying our dues to position us for the next phase. Only you know when you have had enough and it is time to move on. It is important to understand and accept that we each control our own destiny. Do your research and make an informed decision.

Washington, D.C.: Help! I need a mentor!! My career has been bouncing all over the place and I really think I would benefit from the guidance and support of professional mentor.

BUT, there isn't anyone at my current (or past) jobs that could help me. i.e. I am usually the only person in my "department" and therefore not surrounded by other professionals who speak the same language, have similar career goals or challenges...

How do I find a mentor? What do I ask them?

Amy Joyce: Is there anyone you know, even outside of work, maybe someone in a professional organization that you can start to call when you have questions or worries? There are many people out there who would be willing to help. And you don't always need someone in your department. Sometimes, a mentor in a parallel department will be able to be your Yoda. He or she can still advise you if you need it, and be a sounding board when you need to ask questions, rant, whatever. Is there someone at your company you admire? Ask him or her to coffee, start a relationship (no, not THAT kind), and keep up with them. Ask if it's okay if you sometimes run ideas or questions by them. Piece by piece, you will find yourself a mentor.

Robbie Kaplan: If you have to go outside your organization or a professional association - you might think of hiring / using a career center, career counselor or a career coach.

Bethesda, Md.: I recently interviewed for a position for which I am well qualified. When we talked about money, I told the interviewer my current salary range. I was asked if I would take less, especially since I seemed "desperate" for a job. I told that individual that I wasn't desperate but didn't feel that I should have to take significantly less for a job that I would love. (I mean significantly.) Needless to say, I was turned down. What's the best way to handle a situation where you're asked what your salary is before you know the salary they are offering?

Robbie Kaplan: When you are asked what salary you are interested in, reply by asking what is the salary range? Thoroughly research salaries and your worth in the marketplace. Never negotiate without that information. Always try to find out the salary range for potential positions so you have a basis to negotiate.

you don't like your cube?: Wish I HAD a cube - I'm in a triangle of limited workspace to save space since we who travel don't merit larger areas when in the office.

Don't knock it - someone ALWAYS has it worse.

Amy Joyce: Alright guys! You need to get in touch with me. I'm also writing a column on dealing with office space/cubicles, etc. Please feel free to e-mail me when you have issues like these at work. We can chat about it for possible columns, and in doing so, you help your fellow workers. I'm sorry for your triangleness.

Robbie Kaplan: Work with your co-workers to make you space as work conducive as possible. If not, find a more conducive place to handle some of your responsibilities.

Washington, D.C.: I'm contemplating going to Law School in Fall 2003. Taking the entrance tests in June and after I get scores I'll take in from there. Right now I'm working in a secure Federal Job that would be hard to give up to go into massive amounts of debt from law school. How should decide between staying at my current job and going to back to school?

Amy Joyce: Think long and hard about why you want to go to law school, and what you will want to do with your degree once you're done. If you know that you definitely want to do it, then the debt is probably worth it, right? To ease costs, have you thought about working while going to night school? Talk to people in law school, people who completed the degree, etc. Make sure you know what you're getting into. I can't tell you whether you should go or not. But I can tell you to research it to make sure you made the best decision you could.

Robbie Kaplan: Always consider whether this is your passion. Will you regret not going to law school for the rest of your life? Make your decision with careful thought and consideration.

Amy Joyce:

That wraps up today's show. Thanks to everyone who joined the discussion.

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