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Narrative Pt. XIV: The Deposition and Afterward From independent counsel Kenneth Starr's report to the House on President Clinton. Some of the language in these documents is sexually explicit.
XIV. January 17, 1998-Present: | |||||||||
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On Saturday, January 17, 1998, the President testified under oath at a deposition in the Jones case.(999) Judge Susan Webber Wright traveled from Little Rock, Arkansas, to preside at the deposition in Washington, D.C.(1000) Prior to any questions, Judge Wright reminded the parties about her standing Protective Order. She specifically stated: "[I]f anyone reveals anything whatsoever about this deposition, . . . it will be in violation of the Protective Order. This includes the questions that were asked, . . . You may acknowledge that [the deposition] took place, but that is it."(1001) Judge Wright accepted the following definition of the term "sexual relations:" For the purposes of this deposition, a person
engages in "sexual relations" when the person
knowingly engages in or causes . . . contact
with the genitalia, anus, groin, breast,
inner thigh, or buttocks of any person with
an intent to arouse or gratify the sexual
desire of any person . . . . "Contact" means
intentional touching, either directly or
through clothing.(1002)
After the President had answered a few questions about Ms. Lewinsky, his attorney, Robert Bennett, urged Judge Wright to limit further inquiries. Mr. Bennett stated that Ms. Lewinsky had executed an affidavit "saying that there is absolutely no sex of any kind of any manner, shape or form, with President Clinton."(1003) When Judge Wright cautioned Mr. Bennett not to make remarks that "could be arguably coaching the witness," Mr. Bennett represented to Judge Wright: "In preparation of the witness for this deposition, the witness is fully aware of Ms. Lewinsky's affidavit, so I have not told him a single thing he doesn't know . . . ."(1004) President Clinton, who was presentwhen Mr. Bennett made his objection, did not contradict his attorney's comment. Rejecting Mr. Bennett's argument, Judge Wright permitted the questioning about Ms. Lewinsky to continue.(1005) Over the course of extensive questioning, the President testified that he had seen Ms. Lewinsky "on two or three occasions" during the government shutdown in the fall of 1995, including one occasion when she brought pizza to him, and one or two other occasions when she delivered documents to him.(1006) He could not recall whether he had been alone with Ms. Lewinsky on such occasions, although he acknowledged that it was possible.(1007) The President further testified that he could not remember the subject of any conversations with Ms. Lewinsky.(1008) President Clinton recalled that he received only a couple of unremarkable personal messages from Ms. Lewinsky, and he could not recall ever having received a cassette tape from her.(1009) He received presents from her "[o]nce or twice" -- a book or two and a tie.(1010) The President originally testified that he could not recall any gifts he might have given her; later in the deposition, however, he remembered that some merchandise he had purchased from a Martha's Vineyard restaurant might have reached her through Ms. Currie.(1011) The President stated that he might have given Ms. Lewinsky a hat pin, though he could not recall for certain.(1012) The President testified that his last conversation with Ms. Lewinsky had been before Christmas, when she had visited the White House to see Ms. Currie. The President stated: "I stuck my head out, said hello to her."(1013) He said it was also possible that, during that encounter, he had joked with Ms. Lewinsky that the plaintiff's attorneys were going to subpoena "every woman I ever talked to" and Ms. Lewinsky "would qualify."(1014) The President testified that he was unaware that Mr. Jordan had talked with Ms. Lewinsky about the Jones case, in which she had also been subpoenaed to testify at a deposition.(1015) The President emphatically denied having had sexual relations with Ms. Lewinsky.(1016) At the conclusion of the deposition, Judge Wright said: "Before [the President] leaves, I want to remind him, as the witness in this matter, and everyone else in the room, that this case is subject to a Protective Order regarding all discovery, . . . and . . . all parties present, including . . . the witness are not to say anything whatsoever about the questions they were asked, the substance of the deposition, . . . any details, . . . and this is extremely important to this Court."(1017) Sometime after the President's deposition, Mr. Podesta saw Bruce Lindsey, Deputy White House Counsel, at the White House and inquired how the deposition went. According to Mr. Podesta, Mr. Lindsey said that the President had been asked about Monica Lewinsky.(1018) Mr. Lindsey testified that, during a break in the President's deposition, the President had told him that Ms. Lewinsky's name had come up.(1019) That same evening, Mr. Lindsey met with the President in the
Oval Office, where they discussed the deposition.(1020) Mr. Lindsey,
relying on the attorney-client, presidential communication,
deliberative process, and work-product privileges, declined to
say what specifically was discussed at this meeting.
B. The President Meets with Ms. Currie
Soon after the deposition, the President called Ms. Currie
and asked her to come to the White House the next day.(1021) Ms.
Currie acknowledged that, "It's rare for [the President] to ask
me to come in on Sunday."(1022) The President wanted to discuss Ms.
Lewinsky's White House visits.(1023)
At approximately 5:00 p.m. on Sunday, January 18, 1998, Ms.
Currie met with the President.(1024) The meeting took place at her
desk outside the Oval Office. According to Ms. Currie, the
President appeared "concerned."(1025) He told Ms. Currie that,
during his deposition the previous day, he had been asked
questions about Monica Lewinsky.(1026) Ms. Currie testified: "I
think he said, 'There are several things you may want to
know.'"(1027) He proceeded to make a series of statements,(1028) one
right after the other:(1029)
Ms. Currie testified that, based on his demeanor and the way he
made the statements, the President wanted her to agree with
them.(1031)
Ms. Currie testified that she did, in fact, agree with the
President when he said, "You were always there when she was
there, right?"(1032) Before the grand jury, however, Ms. Currie
acknowledged the possibility that Ms. Lewinsky could have visited
the President when she was not at the White House.(1033)
With respect to whether the President was "never really
alone" with Ms. Lewinsky, Ms. Currie testified that there were
several occasions when the President and Ms. Lewinsky were either
in the Oval Office or in the study without anyone else present.(1034)
Ms. Currie explained that she did not consider the President and
Ms. Lewinsky to be "alone" on such occasions because she was at
her desk outside the Oval Office; accordingly, they were all
together in the same "general area."(1035) Ms. Currie testified that
"the President, for all intents and purposes, is never alone.
There's always somebody around him."(1036)
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