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From the Starr Referral:
Lewinsky's Aug. 6 Grand Jury Testimony, Part 1

The following is from a transcript of Monica S. Lewinsky's testimony to the grand jury on Aug. 6 as provided by the Associated Press and transcribed by the Federal Document Clearing House from documents supplied by the House Judiciary Committee. Editor's Note: Some of the language in these documents is sexually explicit.

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was called as a witness and, after having been first duly sworn by the Foreperson of the Grand Jury, was examined and testified as follows:



Q: Good morning.

A: Good morning.

Q: Ms. Lewinsky, this is the grand jury appearance that you'll be make or at least the first of the grand jury appearances, if there will be any more. What we routinely do with witnesses before the grand jury is that we begin the appearance by discussing your rights and your obligations and so that's what we'll do right now.

A: Okay.

Q: What I'd like to say first is that you have a Fifth Amendment right. That Fifth Amendment right is the right to refuse to answer any questions that may tend to incriminate you. Do you understand that right?

A: Yes, I do.

Q: Now, ordinarily, you could refuse to answer questions that would tend to incriminate you. As I understand it, here you have entered into an agreement with the government that provides you with immunity, in exchange for which you will be cooperating with the government. Is that right?

A: Correct.

MR. EMMICK: What I would like to do is show you a copy of what has been marked as Exhibit ML-2.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML-2 was marked for identification.)


Q: Do you recognize this?

A: Yes, I do.

A: On the third page of that document, there is a signature line that says Monica Lewinsky. Is that your signature?

A: Yes, it is.

Q: All right. You also have a right to counsel. What that means is that although your attorney cannot be in the grand jury room here with you, your attorney can be outside the grand jury room and available to answer whatever questions you might have. Do you understand that right?

A: Yes, I do.

Q: Do you have an attorney?

A: Yes, I do.

Q: Who would that be?

A: Several.

Q: All right.

A: Jake Stein, Plato Cacheris -- do you want me to name all of them who are here or just the lead?

Q: All right. Those are the lead counsel?

A: Those are the lead counsel.

Q: All right. And are they outside?

A: Yes, they are.

Q: You understand that if you need to speak with them, all you need to say is "I'd like to speak with my attorneys about something for just a minute"?

A: Yes.

Q: All right. In addition to those two rights that you have, you also have an obligation and that obligation is to tell the truth. That obligation is imposed on you because you have taken an oath and that is the oath to tell the truth. Do you understand that?

A: Yes, I do.

Q: Do you understand that if you were to intentionally say something that's false, in common parlance, if you were to lie, that would constitute perjury and perjury is a felony and it's punishable by up to five years in prison? Do you understand that?

A: Yes.

Q: DO you understand as well that because of the agreement that you have signed if you were to lie, if you were to intentionally lie, that would mean that the agreement that you have that gives you immunity could be voided and you could be prosecuted? Do you understand that?

A: Mm-hmm.

Q: All right. And that in simple parlance, what that means, is that you can retain immunity, but only if you do not lie. Do you understand that?

A: Yes.

Q: Okay. What I'd like to do is simply discuss with you briefly or clarify with you the fact that we have had interviews with you since the time when you signed this agreement. Is that right?

A: Yes.

Q: All right. We've had interviews with you, I believe, every day since the signing of the agreement.

A: Correct.

Q: Several hours a day?

A: Yes.

Q: Is that right? All right. I also wanted to ask you a question having to do with your mental state right now. How are you feeling?

A: Nervous.

Q: Okay. I wanted also to ask you, are you taking any medication at this time?

A: Yes, I am.

Q: What I'd like to ask about that is simply is that having any effect on your ability to recall or to communicate that in some way will hinder your ability to answer questions?

A: I don't believe so, but it affects my short-term memory just a little bit.

Q: Okay. That's fine. Understand, if you will, that your role today is simply to answer questions that we pose to you.

We have spoken with you for a number of hours, a number of days, and we're going to be asking you to talk about essentially three years of conduct. We are not going to be asking you to recount every detail of the last three years of your life and we are not going to be asking you to recount everything that you've told us over the last ten days or so. You'll just be answering questions and we understand that you have other details that you could provide on other occasions.

A: Yes.

MR. EMMICK: All right. What I'd like to do next is to let you know what our approach is going to be today.

What we're going to do is we're going to start off talking about your internship at the white House and then we're going to ask you questions having to do with your relationship with the President.

Because we think that that will proceed more comfortably if those questions are asked by Ms. Immergut, I'm going to turn the questioning over to her and at some point, then, we'll collaborate in asking further follow-up questions. So without further ado --


Q: Ms. Lewinsky, when did you s tart working at the White House?

A: My internship began July of 1995.

Q: And when you say "internship," could you just very briefly describe what it is you were doing and where you were working?

A: Sure. I was interning for Mr. Panetta, who was Chief of Staff at that time, and I worked in his correspondence office preparing his correspondence, drafting some of the language.

Q: Was there ever a time -- or I guess -- after beginning your internship, how long did you serve as an intern in the White House?

A: About four, four and a half months. Four and a half months.

Q: And was there ever a time that you then assumed a staff position that was not an intern position?

A: Yes.

Q: And when would that have been?

A: In November of 1995.

Q: When did you first notice the President of the United States?

A: Our first encounter, I guess non-verbal encounter, was August 9, 1995.

Q: And could you describe what that encounter was?

A: Yes. It was a departure ceremony on the South Lawn and, as he was going by on the rope line shaking hands, we made eye contact and it was more intense eye contact than I had experienced before with him.

Q: Okay. And did you have any further such contact sort of later, after that initial time?

A: Yes. The next day the President -- I guess the staff had a birthday party for the President on the South Lawn and the interns were invited to that later in the day. And at that party, there was sort of a more intense flirtation that went on at a distance.

Q: Okay. Did you feel that he was flirting with you as well? Or how would you describe the behavior that you both exhibited?

A: It was intense eye contact and when he went by the rope line to shake hands, it was -- I mean, he -- he's a charismatic person and so -- just when he shook my hand and -- there was an intense connection.

Q: Okay. And could you sort of just summarize the early relationship that you had with the President before any first sexual contact?

A: I think it was intense flirting.

Q: Okay. Did you have conversations with him?

A: Brief conservation that I think in passing -- if I saw him or -- at a departure ceremony, "Have a nice trip." I introduced myself at one point.

Q: Okay. And how did you manage to run into him or even see him? Was that a common occurrence or how would that be accomplished?

A: Before the relationship began, it was mainly at departure ceremonies, I think there were a few, and then on one occasion my best friend was in town and she was getting a tour of the West Wing and I was waiting for her in the basement lobby and met him that way. There were several other people there.

A: Yes.

Q: And when did that occur?

A: On November 15, 1995.

Q: Okay. And although as I've told you, I'm not going to go into a lot of specific dates, this one that I wanted you to explain sort of how it came about.

A: It was during the furlough. I was up in Mr. Panetta's West Wing office answering phones. The President came down several times during the day.

There was the continued flirtation and around 8:00 in the evening or so I was in the hallway going to the restroom, passing Mr. Stephanopoulos's office and then from there invited me back into his study.

Q: Okay. And what happened there?

A: We talked briefly and sort of acknowledged that there had been a chemistry that was there before and that we were both attracted to each other and then he asked me if he could kiss me.

Q: And what did you say?

A: Yes.

Q: And did you kiss on that occasion?

A: Yes.

Q: And where in the -- you mentioned you went back to the study area.

A: Mm-hmm.

Q: Where exactly did the kiss occur?

A: Right outside his bathroom, in the hallway, inside --adjacent to the study, to the office.

Q: Okay. And how did you end that -- was there anything more than a romantic kiss on that sort of first encounter?

A: No.

Q: Okay. Did you have any later encounter with him on that same date?

A: Yes, I did.

Q: Okay. Could you describe how that occurred?

A: The President came down to Mr. Panetta's office, I think it might have been around 10 p.m., and he told me that if I wanted to meet him back in Mr. Stephanopoulos' office in five minutes, that would be fine. And I agreed. And I met him back there. We went back to his office again, in the back study area.

Q: Okay. And what happened in the back study area?

A: We talked and we were more physically intimate.

Q: Okay. And on that occasion, did you perform oral sex on the President?

A: Yes.

Q: With respect to physical intimacy, other than oral sex, was there other physical intimacy performed?

A: Yes. Everything up until oral sex.

MS. IMMERGUT: Okay. And just for the grand jury purposes, I have marked as an exhibit ML-6 and I'll just read it to the grand jury and place it before you.

(Grand Jury Exhibit No. ML-6 was marked for identification.)

MS. IMMERGUT: It states "Definition of Sexual Relations. For the purposes of the grand jury session, a person engages in 'sexual relations' when the person knowingly engages or causes contact with the genitalia, anus, groin, breast, inner thigh, or buttocks of any person with an intent to arouse or gratify the sexual desire of any person. Contact means intentional touching, either directly or through clothing."


Q: Ms. Lewinksy, do you understand that definition?

A: Yes, I do.

MS. IMMERGUT: And I do have copies to pass out to the grand jury.

BY MS. IMMERGUT: When you described that you had other physical intimacy during your contact with the President on November 15, 1995, did that include sexual relations within the definition of that I've just read to you?

A: Yes, it does.

Q: In that -- again, that second contact with him on November 15, 1995, where exactly did the sexual contact that you've described occur?

A: In the same hallway, by the back study, and then also in his office.

Q: Okay. And the back office, would that be the study area?

A: Yes.

Q: Okay. Did you have further sexual encounters with him after that first time on the 15th?

A: Yes.

Q: When was the next time?

A: On the 17th of November.

Q: And could you explain how that contact occurred?

A: We were again working late because it was during the furlough and Jennifer Palmieri and I, who was Mr. Panetta's assistant, had ordered pizza along with Ms. Currie and Ms. Hernreich.

And when the pizza came, I went down to let him know that the pizza was there and it was at that point when I walked into Ms. Currie's office that the President was standing there with some other people discussing something.

And they all came back down to the office and Mr. -- I think it was Mr. Toiv, somebody accidentally knocked pizza on my jacket, so I went to go use the restroom to wash it off and as I was coming out of the restroom, the President was standing in Ms. Currie's doorway and said, "You can come out this way."

So we went back into his back study area, actually, I think, in the bathroom or in the hallway right near the bathroom, and we were intimate.

Q: Okay. And at that point, what sort of intimacy was it?

A: I believe it was just kissing at that point.

Q: Okay. And how did that encounter end?

A: I said I needed to pack and he said, "Well, why don't you bring me some pizza?" So I asked him if he wanted vegetable or meat.

Q: Okay. And, actually, where did the kissing occur that time?

A: It was -- I think it was in the bathroom or it was right outside the bathroom, in the hallway adjacent to the bathroom.

Q: Okay. So did you go back and get him some pizza?

A: Yes, I did.


Q: Pardon me. Sorry to interrupt. That's the bathroom adjacent to the hallway that leads from the Oval Office to the dining room. Is that correct?

MR. WISENBERG: Sorry for interrupting.


Q: Did you go back and get pizza?

A: Yes, I did.

Q: And did you ever return to the President with the pizza?

A: Yes, I did.

Q: Could you describe what happened when you returned?

A: Yes. I went back to Ms. Currie's office and told her the President had asked me to bring him some pizza.

She opened the door and said, "Sir, the girl's here with the pizza." He told me to come in. Ms. Currie went back into her office and then we went back into the back study area again.

Q: Okay. And what happened in the back study area?

A: We were in the -- well, we talked and then we were physically intimate again.

Q: Okay. And was there oral sex performed on that occasion?

A: Yes.

Q: Okay. And that would be you performing oral sex on him?

A: Mm-hmm.

Q: Okay. And again -- and I have to sort of tell you, you can't answer "Mm-hmm" --

A: Oh, sorry.

Q: Just yes or no, just for the record. With respect to the physical intimacy again, does that fall -- when you say "physical intimacy," do you mean sexual relations within the definition?

A: Yes, I do.

Q: Now, without going into sort of a lot of details of specific dates, I wanted to ask you some general questions about the relationship and to make clear, although we've already -- Mr. Emmick already asked you whether or not you've met with us on several occasions, is it fair to say you've given us many, many details about each of the specific dates involved in the relationship?

A: Yes.

Q: Did the relationship with the President develop into or also have a non-sexual component to it?

A: Yes, it did.

Q: Could you describe sort of that aspect of the relationship for the grand jury?

A: We enjoyed talking to each other and being with each other. We were very affectionate.

Q: What sorts of things would you talk about?

A: We would tell jokes. We would talk about our childhoods. Talk about current events. I was always giving him my stupid ideas about what I thought should be done in the administration or different views on things. I think back on it and he always made me smile when I was with him. It was a lot of -- he was sunshine.

Q: And did he make you feel like he enjoyed your being there and talking to you about things?

A: Yes.

Q: Were there times that you visited him in the Oval Office where there was no sexual contact at all?

A: Yes.

Q: Was there sort of affectionate contact during some of those times?

A: Very. Yes.

Q: Okay. And how would you describe sort of affectionate, but non-sexual contact?

A: A lot of hugging, holding hands sometimes. He always used to push the hair out of my face.

Q: Okay. Could you describe generally how those meetings were set up or how those encounters were actually set up as a general matter?

A: After the first few incidents that sort of happened during the furlough, they were set up -- when I was working in Legislative Affairs, usually the President would call my office on a weekend.

He had told me earlier on that he was usually around on weekends and that it was okay to come see him on the weekends. So he would call and we would arrange either to bump into each other in the hall or that I would bring papers to the office.

Do you want me to do after?

Q: Okay. Then what happened after?

A: Once I left the White House, Ms. Currie arranged the visits.

Q: Okay. And how would she arrange those, typically?

A: I don't understand. I'm sorry.

Q: When you say Ms. Currie would arrange them, how would it come about that they would be set up?

A: Usually either through my talking to the President prior to and then him talking to Ms. Currie or me bugging Ms. Currie to ask the President.

Q: Okay. All right. Did the relationship after the events you've described of November 15th and 17th, did it continue also to have a sexual component?

A: Yes, it did.


Copyright © 1998 The Washington Post Company

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